Rehoming

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fat meloe!
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Rehoming

Post by fat meloe! »

Anyone have ideas about where I can move some of my koi (4-5 in.), which are getting large, and my common pleco (around 2.5 in.), which still has a long way to go but will bust the 50/60 gallon in the future?

Main concern is that I need somewhere that cares about them. If the koi get sold to a pet shop, who will give them cucumbers and spinach and hard boiled egg whites? Will they be sold to some customer who feeds them nothing but pellets all day and might miscare for them?

Same for pleco, with the added note that plecos are mistreated more than koi and that many shops lack the resources to care for them.

See the common pleco Popeye, feeding, and other issues thread in the pleco section for more info.
Viktor Jarikov
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Re: Rehoming

Post by Viktor Jarikov »

It sounds like you are stuck with them for their and your lifetime and will need to keep upgrading their watery playground.

In my ignorance, I've never heard of the diet you are offering to your koi nor do I think that feeding koi only/mostly quality pellet is wrong.

As for "might miscare for them", this is most usually a question of when, not if. In many ways, unlike the mammals and birds, etc. we keep, the fish we are maintaining on life support and things go wrong every now and then. Always. Given koi lifespan of a few decades to a century, something somewhere is bound to go wrong, perhaps any fish keeper would reason.
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fat meloe!
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Re: Rehoming

Post by fat meloe! »

Viktor Jarikov wrote: 03 Apr 2017, 13:57 It sounds like you are stuck with them for their and your lifetime and will need to keep upgrading their watery playground.

In my ignorance, I've never heard of the diet you are offering to your koi nor do I think that feeding koi only/mostly quality pellet is wrong.

As for "might miscare for them", this is most usually a question of when, not if. In many ways, unlike the mammals and birds, etc. we keep, the fish we are maintaining on life support and things go wrong every now and then. Always. Given koi lifespan of a few decades to a century, something somewhere is bound to go wrong, perhaps any fish keeper would reason.
Author William T Innes, in his goldfish book, says that goldfish are happiest when given a varied diet, and goldfish are very related to koi. As a further example, chickens might be able to fulfill all their nutritional needs by eating chicken feed alone, but after they fill up on feed and stop eating it they will never ever pass up the opportunity to eat fresh grass and insects.

Also, as for "might miscare for them"...

I have seen aquariums in businesses such as restaurants with a south American redtailed catfish juvenile (for the ignorant, redtails become enormous) inside, or with what looks like to me too many koi in a tiny space, or with a pacu/piranha or giant gourami in a space so small the fish has barely any swimming room. What if my beloved fish end up like one of them?

Not to mention the demon of overfeeding

And what about the fish killing myth that plecos eat algae and need no other food? Even I have killed plecos this way in the past.


So unless I find some fish store/outdoor pond owner that will care for them responsibly, I might as well be stuck with them.

At least I know of a wealthy botanical garden with koi! Will contact them.
Viktor Jarikov
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Re: Rehoming

Post by Viktor Jarikov »

Agreed. Diversity of foods is important. That's why lots of stuff goes into a quality pellet. And if one can diversify the food they offer to their fish beyond the pellet, it's even better, this goes without saying.

But from whatever little I gathered, it's best to add things that are natural or at least semi-natural to them, that is things of aquatic origin, something they can and do come across in the wild. In case of your example, I find that my koi love whole and cut fish, crustaceans, worms, and insects (all great protein sources) as well as algae / algae wafers instead of the egg white and terrestrial plants, neither of which they can digest well or so the experts explain.

And thank you for explaining the "miscare". Looks like you mostly mean gross and obvious husbandry errors and bad practices.

Sorry for the assumptions, it's just your OP was curt and I interpreted it at the face value that you won't find anyone who'd satisfy your high standards. Perhaps I was "pre-conditioned" by your hard stance against albinism too :) In that vein by the way, line-breeding and inbreeding too causes a great plethora of health problems in koi from obvious deformities to internal problems but this is probably better left for your "Why the albinos don't get hated on here?" thread.
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fat meloe!
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Re: Rehoming

Post by fat meloe! »

Innes also says something along the lines of "Goldfish almost never encounter lettuce or steamed fish in the wild, but since their composition is similar to natural plants and protein it's not a bad idea". Exotic Marine Fishes coauthored by Herbert Axelrod also recommends lettuce, but says the fishes (probably refers to marine fishes only) ignore fresh lettuce and eat thawed frozen lettuce, since the latter is softer and may thus taste like algae. Both books are quite old and thus outdated somewhat though. Which experts did you consult?

Sorry if I sounded a bit rude previously. Online discussion doesn't include facial expressions or tone of voice.
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Re: Rehoming

Post by Jools »

Might be a touch of anthropomorphism creeping in here. My view would be that if fish are happy they grow and reproduce. Koi need a large space to do that. So, either build them a pond or look at how to get them into one by selling then. Food is important, but only a contributing factor to their overall success and there's not a lot wrong with a staple diet of quality pellets.

Jools
Viktor Jarikov
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Re: Rehoming

Post by Viktor Jarikov »

Thank you, Jools.

OP, IMHO, you weren't rude at all. The vibe I perceived (and maybe it's me who has a problem) was that you have very high standards, is all. So I too apologize just in case.

My understanding always evolves but is based on my own experience and that I acquired from reading literature, books, articles, magazines, online write-ups and treatises, and learning from people I hold as experts in the field of fish nutrition.

Examples:

(try to look past the exchange of unpleasanties) http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... hilit=Clay

https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/foru ... st-7297959

https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/foru ... 076/page-2

https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/foru ... ad.536737/

https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/foru ... rns.12521/

Just several examples in a sea of info out there. One can start by typing up "fish nutrition" in PCF or MFK search engine as well as others, google etc.
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