Is it possible to have a yeast bloom in an aquarium?

[kalija]

This may be a crazy question – I just have no other ideas right now as to the cause of my cloudy water. My 125 gallon has been cloudy since about the middle of December. It’s a milky white cloudiness. The tank is 125 gallons and has been set up for over 10 years with no problems. Two Filstar xp3 canister filters and one aqua clear 500. Currently housing a S. decorus; two clown loaches; 9 Corys and 8 diamond tetras and 3 para plecos.

I have taken samples to the lfs to be tested several times; all tests (ammonia; nitrite; nitrate; ph; gh; and kh) have come back fine. Since December I have been changing about ¾ of the water every other week, alternating with 50% water changes. After a big change the water stays somewhat clear for a day or two then gradually get more and more murky. I have not lost any fish and they do not seem stressed.

The reason I am wondering about yeast is that when the water is low enough to create splashing from the filters, a foam builds up. It’s a stiff foam; kind of brownish and it has a definite yeasty odor. Earlier this past fall I had discovered some cory fry in one of my filters and had them in a fry net; I was feeding them micro worms. Now I am wondering if it would be possible that some of the yeast from the micro worm culture could have caused a yeast bloom; but I am not sure if it is even possible for that to happen.

Any thoughts on this or any other ideas?

Thank you in advance!

Karen

[jodilynn]

Are you on a well?

I have a well and it, for lack of a better term, seems to "cycle" a few times a year and I wind up with awful-looking "milky" water. Nothing like spending hours cleaning my tanks only to have them wind up looking horrible when I am done!

There is a thread (amongst others here) over in the African Catfishes forum where my water is discussed. FeatherFinMama seems to think it is cloudy due to high levels of dissolved oxygen????

It's the top (or near to the top) thread about Synos and Ph.

[kalija]

No, I have city water. I checked the current water report and nothing has changed. I do know what you mean about dissolved oxygen in the water. When it is cold here that is fairly commom and I have seen it before. This is just different. The best way I can describe it is, it looks like smoke billowing through the water. I have never seen anything like this. Its weird and super annoying!

[MChambers]

I feed microworms in many of my tanks and I'm sure yeast gets into the water, but I've never had the cloudiness and foam you describe. I have a hard time understanding how aquarium water would have the kind of nutrients yeast needs to reproduce. (You're not filling your tanks with wort, are you? )

So, I don't think it's the yeast, but I suppose it could be possible. What kind of substrate do you have?

[TwoTankAmin]

Sounds like a heterotrophic bacterial bloom which results from excess organics in the water. Unlike the cycling bacteria, the bacteria here can double every 20 or 30 minutes. The other big difference between the two is that the nitrifying bacteria use inorganic carbon (carbonates or co2) while the heterotrophs use organic carbon (think organic wastes).

Typically these occur in newly set up tanks, but they can happen in any tank at any time under the right conditions. The usual treatments are reduced feeding, insuring one is not overdosing dechlors or plant ferts and making sure the substrate is not overly dirty.

I am not sure if I understood what you wrote about your water changes. Are you doing them every week or every other? One of the normal ways to combat cloudy water, besides what I suggested above, is to start doing daily 25% water changes. Between these and the reduced feeding etc, and the tank should clear up fairly fast.

You can also try this http://www.drtimsaquatics.com/cloudy-aquarium-water

[kalija]

I knew the yeast was a long shot - the only thing that made me wonder was the yeasty smell... Yeah, I agree I was thinking it couldn't live in the water but just had to ask!
My substrate is Carib Sea Supernaturals sunset gold sand.
Water changes - yes, I have been doing weekly changes... I usually do 50% every week. After the cloudiness would not go away I started alternating with about 75% changes. So 50% week one / 75 % week two. Just figured more is better?... But now it sounds like I should have been changing less water everyday instead.
So - heterotrophic bacterial bloom - I am going to have to research that. Would that cause any indicators such as ammonia / nitrate readings to be high? I haven't had any ammonia spikes at all like a new tank re-cycling or anything like that.....
I have reduced feedings already because at first I thought it was an algal bloom. So I guess I should do daily 25 % water changes for a while and see what happens.
However - thinking back - right before this started I had an incident where I fed some green beans to my plecos and apparently they did not eat them all. I thought they had, but then found some under a big bogwood piece several days later. Perhaps that started the whole thing.

Any more ideas on how I should combat this?


Thanks for your help!

Karen

[TwoTankAmin]

Bacterial blooms can have multiple causes which all fit under the same roof- excess organics/nutrients in the water. In newer tanks it can be ammonia. In planted tanks if may come from excess fertilizers. In almost any tank excess organics in the substrate or elsewhere can cause a bloom. Over feeding can also cause bacterial blooms.

Heterotrophic. merely means the bacteria need organic carbon as opposed to inorganic. because these bacteria can multiply rapidly, when they do what makes your water cloudy is the actual bacteria.

To clear things up I suggest the following:

1- Daily water changes of 25% or so.
2- Vac the tank with each of the above wcs.
3- Reduce feeding to every other day at most (unless there are fry in the tank).
4. Dr. Tim's product should help if you want to spend the money.

[kalija]

Thank you for your help, TwoTank, I have been doing daily water changes since last Friday and the water is much less cloudy now. It still starts to cloud up during the day, but much less. I think I have a handle on it now at least. I did also add Quick start; not sure if its helping or not. Wonder if I should think about changing out the sand for something else after I get this cleared up - I am starting to think it is part of the problem. It is sometimes hard to get the pleco poo out of the sand. It seems to "stick" to it. I do have cory fry in the tank (in a hanging breeder box) so that doesn't help either. I am working on setting something else up for them....

[kalija]

Ok, so a friend who keeps marine fish suggested that I test my tank for phosphate. I have to admit I have never tested for it; and when I took sample to the LFS for a double-check, they didn't test for it either. Keeping in mind I have been changing 25% of the water every day for over a week now, I am dismayed to find that the test showed 1.0, using the API test kit. I can only imagine how high it might have been before.... I changed another 25% today and re-tested and it was marginally lower. I tested my tap water and that was 0. I added a pack of Phos-Zorb to the filter and will re-test later. Now I am not sure if I have both high phosphate and a bacterial bloom? As I have read that phosphate can be causing the cloudy water alone. The test kit also mentions phosphate precipitating calcium from the water - and I do have a calcium-like build up on my heater.
I know I said my fish all seemed fine; but the last couple days both loaches seem a bit stressed and are not eating.... cats all seem fine at this point.
Girl at the LFS did say that she has had 3 other people mention to her that they have had problems with cloudy water so I am not sure if it came from the tap at some point or if it was just a build up over time in my tank.

[bekateen]

Don't expect just one or two partial water changes to get rid of the phosphate, or any other pollutant for that matter. If you do the math, your first 20% water change left 80% of the phosphate still in the tank. Your second 25% water change removed 1/4 of that 80%, so you still have 60% of the original phosphate in the tank before you added the Phos-zorb. That's why your water tests after 2 water changes didn't show a big drop in phosphate.

Also, I'm inclined to return to what TwoTankAmin said about your substrate. You may have a lot of organic waste build up and you need to vacuum your substrate well, and regularly.

Cheers, Eric

[kalija]

HI Eric,

Yes, no doubt it will take a while to get rid of it; but already the foam seems to be reduced from a week ago, so the water changes have been helping. The substrate may be the biggest problem, I switched to this sand about 6 monthes ago and it is so fine - to really stir it up when cleaning it seems like half the sand gets siphoned out. So I am probably guilty of not stirring it enough but rather hovering over it to get anything accumulated out. I am considering switching it out to something else - not sure what as I really want to keep sand but perhaps one a little courser. Thanks!

Karen

[bekateen]

I switched to this sand about 6 monthes ago and it is so fine - to really stir it up when cleaning it seems like half the sand gets siphoned out. So I am probably guilty of not stirring it enough but rather hovering over it to get anything accumulated out. I am considering switching it out to something else - not sure what as I really want to keep sand but perhaps one a little courser.

Hi Karen,
I started all of my tanks covered with playground sand. My banjo cats and Corys LOVE it, but like you say, some of mine gets sucked out of the tank every time I vacuum. To make matters worse, every time my banjos would go crazy swimming and burrowing, they would throw the sand up into the water and some of the sand would get pulled into my Aqueon QuietFlow HOB power filter, damaging the impeller shaft. By a process of trial and error, I found a very fine gravel at one of my LFS that is ever-so-slightly more coarse than the sand- still fine enough that the fish are happy, but heavy enough that it doesn't get pulled into the filter and I can be a little more aggressive and thorough in my vacuuming without sucking it out. Just keep looking, and you'll find something that suits you better (don't rush; it took me two months).
Cheers, Eric

[dw1305]

Hi all,
I like sand, you don't need to hoover through it, you can just siphon any faeces etc from the top. The only tanks that I don't have sand in are ones with a lot of flow where I have sand, fine gravel and rounded pebbles. I put the sand and gravel in mixed and the water flow sorts it into sand and gravel areas, anywhere where the flow has cleared the gravel down to the glass I put the pebbles. Details here http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... es#p269383 (and in linked thread).

I also have a sponge on all my filter intakes. I like a big block of PPI10 (coarse) foam. There are a number of advantages to a pre-filter sponge. Have a look at this thread <http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... er#p249980>.

cheers Darrel