L46 and the Belo Monte dam

[catfish-john, posts: 5]

@ Janne

You are right in saying that not all local fish will not easyly breed in captivity because it requires a lot of technical equipment to provide nature-like environment. But A LOT of local species could very well be breed. And this is the chance the local should take up and go for it!
And please don't split hair in saying that it may be unavoidable that every now and then some WC fish may be added to the breeding program... SO WHAT - that increases the quality of the local bred fish immensely! As long as it in the odd one AND NOT GOING TO BE EXPORTED I wouldn't mind at all!

Let's not forget the self-healing effect of nature. I have seen local fishermen eating Discus and I was very astonished. Simply because I counted the Dollars this BBQ would have cost a European fish keeper. But this is the wrong approach. The locals eat what is in the river in from of their yard! Be it discus or Piranha or whatever.

Cheers
Catfish-John

[Janne]

But A LOT of local species could very well be breed. And this is the chance the local should take up and go for it!

If we are talking about species living in Rio Xingu that will be affected by the dams, there will only be a few species that could be bred by local people. If we are talking about species living in small tributaries like creeks and ponds in the rain forest, better to protect these areas and harvest what nature natural will produce in a sustainable way even if these species would be more suited to breed by the local people.

And please don't split hair in saying that it may be unavoidable that every now and then some WC fish may be added to the breeding program... SO WHAT - that increases the quality of the local bred fish immensely! As long as it in the odd one AND NOT GOING TO BE EXPORTED I wouldn't mind at all!

I don't split hair, this is the view of the authorities on this issue and not mine, IBAMA will never say "so what" nor any other authority.
The only way to succeed with any kind of breeding project when you exploit the nature is to have everyone with you and follow the law, if not there will never be any project.

Janne

[Mike_Noren, posts: 1395]

And he will be replaced by a person who has the interests of ?? at heart.

I doubt the politicians will make the mistake of placing someone who cares about the environment on that post again.

[Donald, posts: 3]

IBAMA approved the clearing of forest at the planned site for the Belo Monte hydroelectric plant.

[macvsog23, posts: 209]

I have just watched a program on TV about this area and the large catfish that use some of the areas as a migratory route. Native fishing takes place along these routes.
Using very simple traps and spears. Thus allowing the amount of food taken to be of low impact, they will suffer and possibly become extinct along with the fish.

Just fine and dandy then we have now wiped out god knows how many number of animals due to our greed and short sightedness now we will remove the food supply to the local people,

[grokefish, posts: 1531]

What tv show was that and what channel dude?

[macvsog23, posts: 209]

one of the cable ones called extreem fishing or some thing like that
they were pulling RTC out of the water the size of a adult human

[matthewfaulkner, posts: 290]

Can anyone comment on the effects of fish levels where dams in the Amazon have already been built?

[MatsP]

Can anyone comment on the effects of fish levels where dams in the Amazon have already been built?

That's clearly a complicated matter to determine concisely.

The NUMBER of actual individual fish (or amount of weight) of fish may for example increase, but the variety (biodiversity) is likely to go down, because most of the dam is one large, slow-moving, body of water, rather than a combination of fast-flowing and riffles, along with slower sections, etc. The habitat diversity in a big dam is much less diverse than the same section of river...

Here's a paper (I haven't read it) that discusses some consequences of building dams in rivers.

--
Mats

[bamboosticks, posts: 41]

Am I justified in shouting hallelujah?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-12586170

Yay.

[MatsP]

It's a step in the right direction, but there are strong forces FOR the dam, and they have a HUGE amount of money after all, the company that is building the dam will be paid some $10-20 billion or so - so 1% of the "invoice" for is $100-200 million - that's a pretty huge amount of money - and most companies at this level won't mind "giving" a small part of a percent to someone for "fixing" a problem...

Unfortunately, I doubt it will stop the plans for very long...

--
Mats

[Linus_Cello, posts: 220]

And the saga continues:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-15102520

Brazil judge halts work on Belo Monte Amazon dam

A judge in Brazil has ordered a halt to construction of a multi-billion-dollar dam project in the Amazon region.

Judge Carlos Castro Martins barred any work that would interfere with the natural flow of the Xingu river.

He ruled in favour of a fisheries group which argued that the Belo Monte dam would affect local fish stocks and could harm indigenous families who make a living from fishing.

[Elwood, posts: 85]

And the saga continues:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-15102520

Brazil judge halts work on Belo Monte Amazon dam

A judge in Brazil has ordered a halt to construction of a multi-billion-dollar dam project in the Amazon region.

Judge Carlos Castro Martins barred any work that would interfere with the natural flow of the Xingu river.

He ruled in favour of a fisheries group which argued that the Belo Monte dam would affect local fish stocks and could harm indigenous families who make a living from fishing.

Good news!!!!

[bsmith, posts: 307]

SCORE!!!

[lotsabettas, posts: 59]

Thats awesome news Hopefully it will result in a full stop not just a temporary reprieve

[TwoTankAmin, posts: 194]

Brazil Minister Says Belo Monte Halt Likely To Be Overturned

By Diana Kinch and Paulo Winterstein
Published September 30, 2011 | Dow Jones Newswires

RIO DE JANEIRO -(Dow Jones)- Brazil's Environment Minister Izabella Teixeira said Friday that she expects an injunction blocking work on the Belo Monte to be overturned, allowing construction of the dam to move forward.

Earlier this month a judge suspended construction of the dam on behalf of a fishermen's association in the Amazon region of the Xingu River, where the 11,200 megawatt dam is being built. The judge said that work on the dam itself was prohibited, but allowed continued work on construction site preparation since that didn't interfere with the river's navigability and fishing activity.

Teixeira said that neither her ministry or the environmental regulator Ibama had been notified about the injunction, but she said she was certain it would be overturned.

According to Teixeira, the dam is in accordance with all Brazilian laws and was duly licensed without government interference.

Environmentalists and other opponents of the dam say it will severely alter the livelihood of nearby indigenous communities and force the removal of thousands of families from the region.

Every fish taken from the big bend before they eradicate them is one more fish saved. Save enough individuals and its likely a species saved from extinction.

[racoll, posts: 4474]

Every fish taken from the big bend before they eradicate them is one more fish saved. Save enough individuals and its likely a species saved from extinction.

Couldn't disagree more. I know this has been discussed before, but perhaps it's worth mentioning again.

The anti-dam lobby need to speak with a united voice, and this means respecting IBAMA and the law! The aquarium hobby could really not do with being the "bad guys" here. Upsetting IBAMA with this kind of nonsense is a sure-fire way to get more species banned.

Taking fishes out of the river is simply supplying pets for the pet trade. It does not provide any meaningful conservation value whatsoever.

[TwoTankAmin, posts: 194]

All I know is that the only way zebra plecos will survive the dam is via captive breeding across the world in the tanks of hobbyists.

IBAMA is useless imo. They will do nothing to protect anything.

[Shane]

All I know is that the only way zebra plecos will survive the dam is via captive breeding across the world in the tanks of hobbyists.

Could you explain this? The most basic tenet of collecting is "once caught, never returned." Do people think that the Brazilian government is going to someday start buying plecos back from US and European hobbyists as part of some restocking program?

I really am not trying to be argumentative, but as Racoll said, every fish removed is just another item to be bought and sold in the aquarium trade. I don't see the link with conservation.

-Shane

[racoll, posts: 4474]

[IBAMA] will do nothing to protect anything.

I can't agree with this either.

I'm sure IBAMA are doing everything in their power to get the dam project stopped. The problem is, they don't have a lot of power, and that isn't their fault. After all, they are employed by the people who are backing the dam ...