Lophiobagrus brevispinis Breeding tank.

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

I finally got a proper breeding tank setup for my L.brevispinis to breed in. I have 8 in a 30 gallon and a couple of them paired off in the past a spawned but never got any fry out of it. So I decided to take out one male and two female and place them in a breeding tank. Once they breed I will take the females out and take the male out once the fry become to much for him to keep them in the cave/PVC pipe. Here are some pics.

[sidguppy, posts: 3827]

it's looking good, but you really should remove the wood....

Lophiobagrus is a Tanganyikan fish; it needs hard, alcalic water and bofwood tends to soften water and lower the pH

better use limestone or something similar

also; some kind of backpanel will make the fish feel less shy; it can just be a sheet of black plastic ducktaped to the backpanel on the outside

plenty good enough for a breeding tank.

but any kind of 'wallpapering' the back (and sides) of a tank is better than none.

old tricvk in my book: cap those pipes and fill em halfway with sand!
the pair or male will dig out the sand and he'll wnd up with a 1-way cave.

in a tunnel such as you have now they will hide, but very unlikely breed

another trick and it'll up the hardiness as well is using large seashells; the kind that had a snail in em, not a bivalve.
about size, the same size people use for breeding Altolamprologus, not the small ones used for occies or multies.

they can and do breed in large shells too, especially if the opening is halfway in the sand.

they glue their eggs in the back of said çave'; since a tunnel doesn't have a back end, they won't use it to breed

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

Thanks for the pointers. I had a hard time finding end caps for the pipe in my 30 gallon so I used slate rocks to cap off the end of the pipe. But I might have better luck finding end caps for this PVC pipe, but if not would using small pieces of slate work aswell.
Yes I definatly have to get something for the back, even just for the facted the window is right behind it so I need something to prevent a huge algae break out ( lesson learned from the 30 gallon which is right next to it ).
I could replace the wood with a rock of sorts. I put it in there to break the flow from the filter a bit. I wanted good circulation in the tank but in turn it blows around the sand a good bit. But perhaps I could use on of the rocks in my vast collection to do the same thing.
So I guess it is just a waiting game after I get those items taken care of. There is a more mature female in the 30 gallon, but I couldn't get her at the time I was cleaning the tank. I am feeding them frozen Mysis shrimp and sinking pellets.

[Oliver D., posts: 114]

Hi,

the best way to breed my Lophiobagrus cyclurus are half coconuts with only one hole, large enough for the male. I have tried some other caves, but everytime they prefer the coconuts.
The coconuts have the same effect like wood, as posted by sidguppy. So I use only old coconuts, which was for 1 or 2 years in an other tank. The discharge of humic acid to the water is much lower than in fresh coconuts.

It works fine:




(The visible site stands normaly to the sand, but I´ve need some photos for an german breeding report. )

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

I found that mine bred in a terra cota pot and underneath some drift wood in the 30 gallon. But I did pick up a few caps for the pipe in the breeding tank along with some black backing for the tank itself. I still wonder if I should to to catch the more mature female and place her in the breeding tank and remove one of the females that is already in there.

[Taratron, posts: 742]

So cute! I wish we could get these in the states!

[TheCichlidKid15, posts: 47]

anybody selling any of these?

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

Ok I added the pipe with the end caps on them, put on the black backing and I added the more mature female. So I guess now it is just to wait.

[sidguppy, posts: 3827]

Patience, young Jedi

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

I noticed today that I can only see one female and one male. So I'm assuming the other female is in the pipe with the male. I did take a quick panic look around the tank to make sure she didn't jump out, but I didn't find anything. I did have them in pretty good breeding condition in the 30 gallon together and that more mature female was somewhat gravid. So hopefully they are going to spawn, should I take out the other female? I don't what to disturbe them though too much. I guess I could take both females out once the male kicks her out of the pipe.

[Taratron, posts: 742]

Any news of eggs or fry yet? Does anyone know of a breeder in the US?

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

Just cleaned the breeding tank and to my unexpected surprise 20 or so fry!!!! I put the fry in a 3 gallon tank just so I have some time to get the parents out of the breeding tank. So tonight I'll get the parents out and transfer the fry back into the 10 gallon. I'm going to take my time adding the fry back into the other tank, probably float them for a good while. I would say they are about 3 weeks old, they look like miniature versions of the parents.

[dw1305, posts: 329]

Hi all,

the best way to breed my Lophiobagrus cyclurus are half coconuts with only one hole, large enough for the male. I have tried some other caves, but everytime they prefer the coconuts. The coconuts have the same effect like wood, as posted by sidguppy. So I use only old coconuts, which was for 1 or 2 years in an other tank.

I don't know anything about Lophiobagrus, but I can confirm that coconut shells themselves are inert, and don't have any effect on pH or hardness. They are basically 100% lignocellulosic materials (lignin, pentosan and cellulose) and are incredibly hard. In fact even if you can't get all the coir fibres off, they aren't going to have much effect on water conditions.

I would actually say that you can also ignore the softening effects of wood in "Tanganyikan" tanks, the water should be so hard and buffered that the addition of the humic acids from wood is going to have very little effect on dKH or pH.

I've done some experiment with our tap water (about 17dKH) and the only humic substance that had any significant effect on water parameters was sphagnum peat, presumably because of its very high CEC and all the cation exchange sites initially having a proton (H+ ion) present.

Even here a large volume of peat is required to soften a small amount of tap water.

cheers Darrel

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

I started a new brine shrimp culture last night, I want to bulk up the fry before I move them back into the bigger rearing tank. Thry all seem to be doing fine so far. Very active once the lights go out like their parents. I have been feeding them finely crushed flakes while the BBS get going. going to do daily water changes while they are in the 3g.

[Richard B, posts: 6306]

Hi all,

the best way to breed my Lophiobagrus cyclurus are half coconuts with only one hole, large enough for the male. I have tried some other caves, but everytime they prefer the coconuts. The coconuts have the same effect like wood, as posted by sidguppy. So I use only old coconuts, which was for 1 or 2 years in an other tank.

I don't know anything about Lophiobagrus, but I can confirm that coconut shells themselves are inert, and don't have any effect on pH or hardness. They are basically 100% lignocellulosic materials (lignin, pentosan and cellulose) and are incredibly hard. In fact even if you can't get all the coir fibres off, they aren't going to have much effect on water conditions.

I would actually say that you can also ignore the softening effects of wood in "Tanganyikan" tanks, the water should be so hard and buffered that the addition of the humic acids from wood is going to have very little effect on dKH or pH.

I've done some experiment with our tap water (about 17dKH) and the only humic substance that had any significant effect on water parameters was sphagnum peat, presumably because of its very high CEC and all the cation exchange sites initially having a proton (H+ ion) present.

Even here a large volume of peat is required to soften a small amount of tap water.

cheers Darrel

This is good info Darrel - probably worthy of wider note, as opposed to being somewhat hidden away in this thread.

Back to the topic in hand - good results on the breeding - well done - seems there is a good potential market in NA & Canada...

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

The fry are doing well so far. I added a piece of pipe, tiny terra cotta pot and some Java Fern just so they have some things to hide under. They are staying huddled up digging out small hallows with their heads and every now and then disperse to explore the tank. I have been feeding them BBS, but I'm wondering what strategies are used when feeding them? I know the adults I have will take food anytime of the day, but primarily when the lights are off.

[racoll, posts: 4473]

I would actually say that you can also ignore the softening effects of wood in "Tanganyikan" tanks, the water should be so hard and buffered that the addition of the humic acids from wood is going to have very little effect on dKH or pH.

Why I agree with your statement, it will obviously depend on the initial alkalinity of the water, which in this case, we do not know.

Regardless, I still wouldn't add wood to a Rift Lake tank. It will certainly increase the organic content of the water, and while I don't have any proof of its effects on the fish, seeing as the wood is serving no useful purpose, I wouldn't personally take the risk even with well buffered water.

[sidguppy, posts: 3827]

if the risk of softening the water is minimal, it's still not a good idea

because the wood will leach organic compounds in the water and no Rift fish will be happy with those, regardless of changes to pH or hardiness

my experiences with tanganyikans are that even if they're not harmed by it, they still do better if you avoid wood altogether.


about feeding:
you can feed the youngsters any time of the day or night, but if you dim the light they will come out faster

there's something else: they do not feed the first few days, even after "coloring up".

when hatched the young are a translucent glassy grey.
then while the yolk sac disappears and all the fins develop, they turn dark

they still don't feed but mill around in a tight ball.
after a few days they start to swarm and this is the time to start feeding

BBS is very good, you can also use micro worms, but beware of the organic compound issue.
once they start eating, you can add finely crumbed flake and cyclops.

it's better to feed small portions a few times than to dump all in 1 go.

check the catelog for fry pics; I have put in pics of the 'swarm phase" so you can see what it looks like.

http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/im ... ge_id=4447

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

Thanks for the pointers. This morning several of the fry were swimming frantically around the tank so I gave them some more BBS. But the majority of the group are still in their dug out hallow under a rock. Hopefully I will start seeing all of them come out for feeding.

[CatWhat, posts: 80]

Everyone was out last night with full pink stomachs. Now just to bulk them up while they are in the smaller rearing tank and continue doing 50% water changes per day.