Orange spot bristlenoses L043

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 08 Jan 2006, 07:37

i have recently got 3 orange spot bristlenoses. could someone plz give me some information on breeding and caring for thm because i have found that information on them is difficalt to find.

Thanks Karl

blueguava · Post by **blueguava** » 08 Jan 2006, 22:50

These aren't too difficult, they will breed in normal tap water 25 degrees PH 7. 10% water changes weekly and 30% every 4th week and you shouldn't have to many problems.

Fish will need to be at least 2.5-3years old to be able to breed I have found. Feed zucc daily and sinking shrimp pellets twice a week to condition for breeding.

Kind Regards

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 09 Jan 2006, 01:18

thanks for that info. Have you breed them befor? iv herd that they have between 8-12 young at a time and the father is farily clumsy and knocks the eggs of the cave is this true?

Karl

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blueguava · Post by **blueguava** » 09 Jan 2006, 23:16

Are you 100% that you have L043? If you have bought them locally from a fish shop or local breeder they will most prob be our own ver of the "Orange spot BN"

No one in Australia knows for sure if the Orange Spot Bristlenose we have here in AU is A. leucosticta, L110 or LDA45/L349 etc. Problem is no one knows where it came from (or even when it entered Australia though there have been guesses as to when it was first seen in fish shops). There are just too many differences in the fish here compared to those which are similar in Aqualog.

The ones I have bred look very similar to L110. They have approx 40-60 fry per batch and the fry are extremely hard to keep alive if your water quality isn't close to perfect.

They breed very similar to most Ancistrus. Cave spawners with a diet of 90%veg.

Kind Regards.

Post by **Janne** » 10 Jan 2006, 08:32

I have bred some other blackwater species of Ancistrus, I have not kept L110 but they could be similar. They needed soft and acid water 80-100 ÂµS with a pH level around 6.0 with regulary water changes with prepared water to keep it stable and quality high, the surviving rate for the fry was much better in a lower range of temperature 24-25 C then it was when I kept them around 27-28 C and I was not successful before I lowered the temp.
They spawned in my regular tapwater but the male always kicked the eggs out of the cave and not before I adjusted the water parameters was he taking care for them in a regular Ancistrus manner.

Datz states that L110 will reach 20 cm which can explain Blueguava's statement that they need to be 2,5-3 years old before mature when most of the small species of Ancistrus get mature after 1-2 year. If they reach this size they should produce a lot more fry then 40-60 maybe around 300-400 as fully grown adults.

Even if I have bred other species then yours this can be a little help.

Janne

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 11 Jan 2006, 12:29

Im 95% sure that they are. They where brought in South australia at one of the shops that i work. The fish that i have are breed in Qld and i think that the breeder has about 6 brood-stock. The shop owner i know very well, knows his plecos extreamly well and he is selling them under that name.im very sure that they are.

pureplecs · Post by **pureplecs** » 11 Jan 2006, 13:00

karl, have you found them to be somewhat chamelion in nature? I mean, do their spots change color depending on what ornament or driftwood they may be resting on? Just curious.

Yann · Post by **Yann** » 11 Jan 2006, 13:20

Hi!

THe thing that bother me is that Ancistrus sp L43 is coming from French Guyana, and since many years now, there is no fish export from there. The only way to have these enter the hobby is to go there and catch them by yourself!!

I don't want to doubt your boss opinion but if you had a pictures of them that would really be great... it will to confirm or not the identification!!

Cheers
Yabb

blueguava · Post by **blueguava** » 11 Jan 2006, 21:17

Karl

The "Orange Spot BN" that we have here has quite a few varients to it's shape size and color due to cross breeding over the years and I personally have seen 5 versions and the owners knew them by many different L numbers.

I have to agree with Yabb in that I don't know of anyone here in Oz breeding L043 (doesn't mean there isn't) as they are rather rare.

Here are some pics of what is commonly agreed by 13 orange spot breeders that I know our "Orange Spot BN". I have included a stressed out picture also to show how their color changes.

Can you post some pics of yours?

Kind Regards

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 12 Jan 2006, 01:31

Pureplecs- the colours of the fish havent changed unless the are unwell.

i will post a picture soon.

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 12 Jan 2006, 13:43

Here is a pic of one of the little fellas and thanks for the help blueguava, but sorry i dont lnow there age. They are between 2.5 and 3.5 cm long if that helps.

Yann · Post by **Yann** » 12 Jan 2006, 23:04

HI!

L43 has very small spot and a "orange/yellow seam in the caudal fin... so they are no L43 sorry... which one might be harder to tell!!! But aren't to far away from the last pic shown by pureplec!!

Cheers
Yann

Karl K J · Post by **Karl K J** » 13 Jan 2006, 12:12

Could someone plz help me identify this fish if it is not L043.

Thanks Karl

snowball · Post by **snowball** » 17 Sep 2006, 11:35

Here's a few pics of some Orange Spot BN / A. leucostictus that I recently obtained from a local breeder in Sydney.

It doesn't really look like the blury A. leucostictus pic on fishbase, the spots are smaller.
It does appear to be more of a brown colour than blueguava's pics, but that could be lighting. One thing that it does appear to have in common and which all those in the LFS displayed is the prominent pair of barbles that extend from the front of the lip. Could this be a distinguishing feature?

Post by **Borbi** » 17 Sep 2006, 14:23

Hi Snowball,

I would suggest that your fish is actually Ancistrus p. "Rio Ucayali" (at least thatÂ´s what Seidel/Evers call it in the Wels Atlas 2). IÂ´m breeding that species for some time now and was convinced, that it is Leucostictus in the beginning. But when you see the juvenile colouration (for like the first two-four weeks) itÂ´s impossible to mix them. They are totally different from Leucostictus and with that could be easilly identified as A. sp. "Rio Ucayali". That species is present in Germany since around the 80s (and was ever since misstaken as A. Leucostictus).
Also, those two prominent barbles you describe is very typical to them (assuming my fry are "typical").
This one here is, by the way, around 4-5cm:

And (different fish, same size) from above:

If you find this net-like markings, I would say they are pretty likely A. sp. "Rio Ucayali".

Greetings, Sandor

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » 18 Sep 2006, 02:17

These look extremely similar to the one we have in Australia. But without collection data (about the OZ ones) I imagine it would be quite difficult to work out thier true identity.
Shaun

snowball · Post by **snowball** » 20 Sep 2006, 01:43

Thanks Borbi for posting thos photos of A. sp. "Rio Ucayali", they are the closest in appearance to those I have. On face value I would say they are they same fish, however as Shaun points out it would be very difficult to verify as those originaly imported into Aus were in all likelyhood smuggled in without any reference to their origin.

I cannot find much information about A. sp. "Rio Ucayali", does it have an L number attached to it? A search revealed a few Pekoltia and Panaques refered to as "Rio Ucayali", but no Ancistrus.

Post by **Borbi** » 20 Sep 2006, 07:43

Hi Snowball,

IMHO for this differentiation, no origin is needed. Regarding the adult colouration, they can either be A. Leucostictus, A. sp. "Rio Ucayali" and perhaps A. sp. "Rio Marmore" (with some fantasy).
But according to fry colouration, these species differ significantly. When IÂ´m back home, I could post some pictures taken at the first days, if anyone is interrested. Unfortunately, I cannot post any pictures of A. Leucostictus since I never had any. But there is a bunch of pictures in the Wels Atlas 2 showing the fry colouration.

This species has no L-Number, most likely because it was long since present in german aquaristics, when L-Numbers were invented..
Anyway, I can summarize what Wels Atlas 2 says about them, when IÂ´m finished working.

And one addition: It is really hard to find any pictures on the internet, that show A. Leucosticus for sure. But checking for any of those, I eventually found this one: http://www.auburn.edu/academic/science_ ... strus.html
which I believe can be assumed to show a real Leucostictus.
If you compare "his" barbles with those:

you find, that "my" fish has no split barbles at all. And that seems to be a common feature in A. sp. "Rio Ucayali" males.

Greetings, Sandor

P.S.: IÂ´m with Shaun at the point, that (IMHO) no fish can be identified 100% without having caught and named it yourself. But right now, I believe that comparing juvenile colouration, is the best method to distinguish any spotted, brown Ancistrus.