My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Thanks @Dis.

Alas, on the day the eggs were scheduled to hatch, the filter clogged in the tank and all three males lost almost all their eggs and some hatchlings at the same time, I suspect due to hypoxia (low oxygen). The dads kicked them all out of the caves. None of the adults died that night, and only one of the smallest babies from earlier spawns died (they were in fry baskets in the same tank). Thankfully, the hypoxia appears to have been mild enough that it really only impacted the eggs and new hatchlings which were all in caves rather than in open water.

I cleared the filters within hours, and some of the hatchlings survived and are now loose in the tank. Unfortunately, I haven't seen any baby P. compta yet, so maybe only L397 hatchlings survived.

@Fundulopanchax76, I'm using municipal water treated only with Aquavitro alpha (like Seachem Prime) to remove chloramines. The pH is about 7.5 and the TDS is around 350ppm. The temperature is 84F.

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

I forgot to mention that the first male L397 to spawn in August is currently sitting on another clutch of eggs. If you count the clutch lost when the filter clogged, this is his fourth clutch in two months.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Dis »

Wow sorry about the filter. Such a pain but I guess it can always be something.

Good luck with this spawn
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Fundulopanchax76 »

So how many juveniles have you got now Eric ?
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

I presume the numbers are about the same from the first two clutches - 60 fry plus or minus a few.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

bekateen wrote: 15 Oct 2017, 17:08 I presume the numbers are about the same from the first two clutches - 60 fry plus or minus a few.
I feel that L397s (and maybe other species) are breeding like guppies in your tank... so natural and easy.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

nabulus wrote: 19 Oct 2017, 19:44I feel that L397s (and maybe other species) are breeding like guppies in your tank... so natural and easy.
I can't validate the other species, but yes the L397 seem to like this tank. Just last night I pulled an additional 18 babies out of a dad's cave and put them in a fry basket as I did with the first babies. A few days ago, another male spawned and was sitting on a pile of eggs, but when I came home from work a day or two later, all his eggs were gone, nowhere to be seen. :-(

However, perspective is needed on the "guppy" comparison - while these do seem to breed readily, they don't produce a lot of fry at a time. So far my biggest clutch is about 40 eggs. But if you think about it, other plecos can easily put out a couple of hundred eggs at a time. So frequency of broods is very high, but overall production is pretty modest. :-)

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Eric, what was the temperature before you did 90% water change and what was it after? At Barbie's presentation she mentioned something like 85F -> 75F (?).
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

My tank is heated to 84F. When I do water changes, the magnitude of the temperature drop in the aquarium varies from summer to winter, based upon how cold the water coming out of the faucet is: In the summer, even my "cold" tap water is nearly 80F, so there is little change in overall tank temperature. Currently (in late November), the tap water is very cold, so after refilling the tank, the final aquarium temperature is 72F.

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

bekateen wrote: 29 Nov 2017, 20:57 My tank is heated to 84F. When I do water changes, the magnitude of the temperature drop in the aquarium varies from summer to winter, based upon how cold the water coming out of the faucet is: In the summer, even my "cold" tap water is nearly 80F, so there is little change in overall tank temperature. Currently (in late November), the tap water is very cold, so after refilling the tank, the final aquarium temperature is 72F.

Cheers, Eric
Thanks for the info!
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

bekateen wrote: 29 Nov 2017, 20:57 My tank is heated to 84F. When I do water changes, the magnitude of the temperature drop in the aquarium varies from summer to winter, based upon how cold the water coming out of the faucet is: In the summer, even my "cold" tap water is nearly 80F, so there is little change in overall tank temperature. Currently (in late November), the tap water is very cold, so after refilling the tank, the final aquarium temperature is 72F.

Cheers, Eric
I have been thinking about this. So basically you did not try to control for water parameters. It seems that the abrupt change (improvement) of water quality induced their spawn...
During the winter you also do 90% with cold tap water per week? 72F sounds very low.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Yes that's how I do it. Not so precise, maybe 70%-90%.

And in midwinter, tap water is so cold I add a little hot water from sink to prevent aquarium from falling below 72F.

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

Eric, time to show some of your L397 offspring, please.

What are you doing to drive these insane growth rates on them? :D
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Jobro wrote: 02 Jan 2018, 23:07 Eric, time to show some of your L397 offspring, please.

What are you doing to drive these insane growth rates on them? :D
Here's a video on Facebook (Link). Sorry it's not on YouTube, so I can't embed it here. For what it's worth, this video does not show the largest fry. The biggest fry in this video are 2"/5cm TL.

I think L397 is just a fast growing species. Given that mine were imported at between 3 and just over 4cm TL when I bought them, and now they've grown to adulthood and spawned within 13 months of arrival, it says a lot about their growth rate.

The tank temperature is 85F; well circulated with filters and powerheads. Food includes live blackworms, lots of raw sweet potato, occasional boiled shrimp or clams, algae wafers, Spirulina flakes, shrimp, pleco, and worm pellets of various brands, and wood - lots of wood.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Eric, what kind of wood is best (and cheap...) for L397 and how often do you replenish the wood?
Thanks!
Best, Ke
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Hi Ke,

I buy Malaysian driftwood at LFS and I collect dead fallen dry Manzanita or oak in the wild.

Other safe woods are out there, but I can't think of them all.

There are several forum threads on safe woods: https://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/sea ... mit=Search

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Jobro wrote: 02 Jan 2018, 23:07Eric, time to show some of your L397 offspring, please.
Here are a couple of pics - not the largest baby, but the largest I could get photos of.

Cheers, Eric
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WP_20180107_12_52_35_Pro.jpg
L397 big kid (2).jpg
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

pretty hard to believe how fast they grow. This is almost beyond most ancistrus growth rates.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

Sorry to bomb your thread, Eric, just a little question on the side, what gender would you put the following L397 in?
Thank you!
WP_20180111_10_25_18_Rich[1].jpg
WP_20180111_10_25_10_Rich[1].jpg
only have that one, they are pretty hard to come by around my region =(

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

I tried to get some better pictures. It is 6.5cm SL / 8.5cm TL.
WP_20180125_11_25_49_Rich.jpg
WP_20180125_11_26_44_Rich.jpg
WP_20180125_11_26_50_Rich.jpg
WP_20180125_11_27_27_Rich.jpg
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

I don't see much odontode development.

At that size, I'd say female.

And by the way, her colors are great.

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Eric,
Do you still do normal water change (e.g. 50%) while the fish are mating or the males are fanning eggs?

-Ke
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

Hi Ke,

To answer your question, it depends: When a male is trapping a female, I'll skip a water change for a day or more. But I have done water changes while males were fanning eggs several times.

In fact, I'm in the "no water change" situation right now. Saturday I was going to do a water change in the tank with my L397. I currently have one male fanning eggs, so I was going to do the water change. But I noticed my courting - a male and female going into/out of a cave that day, so I didn't do a water change. The water in that tank was already overdue for a change (it had been 2 weeks since the last water change), but I skipped the water change Saturday and again Sunday because of the courting mustard spots.

I am nervous to let the water get so yucky (@nabulus, you've seen how dirty the water is in that tank currently). But then again, I recall my first ever L397 spawn occurred after a period of tank neglect, and I only discovered the dad on wrigglers AFTER I did the water change (the water was so filled with tannins, poop and food sediments that I couldn't see into his cave before the water change :-O ). So I'm hopeful this time that maybe the neglect has allowed the mustard spots to spawn.

To be clear, I'm not saying either of these species NEED dirty water to spawn. I've had multiple spawns from my L397 in clean water since that first spawn in dirty water. Rather, I suspect that the lack of attention which occurs to result in a neglected tank might provide the hesitant fish extended privacy to encourage them to spawn the first time. Once they figure out how much fun spawning is, then they seem to do it more and more, regardless of how much I bother them with water changes.

That's really all speculation on my part - just a theory - but it's a pretty safe theory.

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

I agree with Eric. It is better to neglect a waterchange for some days, when there is breeding activity going on. The less attention you pay to the tank during these days, the better. This is probably true for all species of plecos.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

nabulus wrote: 05 Mar 2018, 19:29Do you still do normal water change (e.g. 50%) while the fish are mating or the males are fanning eggs?
Hi Ke,

Are your new plecos already trapping? :YMPRAY: Or is this for your other plecos? (which would also be nice!)

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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Haha no. It is my L134 group.
Since last December one of the males kept trapping different females and the duration for each trapping usually lasted for more than 1 week and sometimes more than 2 weeks. However, not a single time they produced any eggs.
I wonder what I might have done wrongly. I will just stop doing WC when the trapping happens.

Thanks Eric!
bekateen wrote: 05 Mar 2018, 21:24
nabulus wrote: 05 Mar 2018, 19:29Do you still do normal water change (e.g. 50%) while the fish are mating or the males are fanning eggs?
Hi Ke,

Are your new plecos already trapping? :YMPRAY: Or is this for your other plecos? (which would also be nice!)

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Thank you Jobro and I appreciate your suggestion!
Jobro wrote: 05 Mar 2018, 21:00 I agree with Eric. It is better to neglect a waterchange for some days, when there is breeding activity going on. The less attention you pay to the tank during these days, the better. This is probably true for all species of plecos.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by bekateen »

nabulus wrote: 05 Mar 2018, 22:03It is my L134 group.
Since last December one of the males kept trapping different females and the duration for each trapping usually lasted for more than 1 week and sometimes more than 2 weeks. However, not a single time they produced any eggs.
I wonder what I might have done wrongly.
Ke, you probably haven't done anything wrong. My L201s trapped multiple times unsuccessfully before they finally spawned. Just take good care of them and feed them well, and if they are repeatedly trapping, then eventually they will probably spawn.

Cheers, Eric
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by Jobro »

If you have multiple tanks and multiple males, I would try swapping the dominant male (the one that traps the females so long) into a different tank. Sometimes the less dominant males are the better breeders.
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Re: My new L397s and Peckoltia compta, imported from the UK to California

Post by nabulus »

Thank you Jobro,
I will give it a try!
Jobro wrote: 06 Mar 2018, 09:43 If you have multiple tanks and multiple males, I would try swapping the dominant male (the one that traps the females so long) into a different tank. Sometimes the less dominant males are the better breeders.
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