L128 Spawn!

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MarcW
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

A few more have left the cave now, should I let them roam around the tank or catch them in a breeding trap? I have a feeling that they may be better in the tank, as the one pictured above didn't survive in a floating breeding trap.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by krazyGeoff »

My preference is to leave the fry in the tank. I personally think that the thin bio film on the glass on the tank is a food source.
The only time I have used breeding traps is where I have been able to "age" the breeding trap by having it in the tank for several weeks before using it.

Just my preference though.

Cheers
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Thanks Geoff, I have only had one spawn in the past with , those were left in the parents tank until they were large enough to sell on, and seemed to have a good survival rate, I would guess 90% or more, as I didn't find any dead ones.

With this spawn I have had 5-6 dead fry so far, they seemed to be accidently kicked out of the cave alive, then 5-10 hours later died. They are getting more active now and seem to be able to swim out of the cave themselves.

I plan to make a feeding station for them out of an upturned terracotta plant saucer with Repashy food inside, just with small entrances so no other fish can enter and out compete the fry for food.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

I've just found a couple more dead fry, they don't appear to have any obvious problems, any ideas what may have caused them to die? Maybe they just need another day or two in the cave?
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

I have a theory about the fry dying, as they seem to be alive and well after escaping from the cave, could it be they are finding leftover food to eat, which then causes them to choke or interfere with their breathing? I have read that fry should not be fed before they have used up the yolk sac, so maybe this is the case.

While waiting for them to grow, I have made a couple fry feeders from terracotta saucers I plan to put these over the fry food, so only they can access it and also take shelter if needed.

I am planning to feed them with Repashy Soilent green, which is mostly algae based, as I read that too much fish or meat can be bad for young fry. Any thoughts on what else to feed them? I have all the usual wafers/tablets/granulated/flake food, as well as a few Repashy flavours, and frozen bloodworm/daphnia, etc.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by smitty »

Congrats your the spawn. Hope everything turns out good.
150gal- No Plecos; 3 AC 110 P.Filters; 2 AC P.Heads; Eheim2217, 2260
180gal- Plecos (9): L001/L022 (1M), L023, L083/L165, L137, L190, Rhino (1M, 1F), Trinidad (2); 3 AC 110 P.Filters; 2 AC 110 P.Heads; Eheim 2217,2260; Fluval FX5
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Thanks Smitty.

I returned from a couple days away to find a few more dead fry. There are maybe 10-15 left in the cave, and at least 5 individuals doing well outside of the cave. Based on my earlier estimates there should be about 10-20 more somewhere, they are well camouflaged against the grey sand and slate so they could be hiding.

There is still visible yolk sac left, although much smaller than a couple days ago. I think I'll need to start feeding them in the next couple days or so.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Hi All,

I have just removed 6 more dead fry.

There are 6 still in the cave with the male, and 4 I can see alive outside of the cave. Probably several more which I can't see, I've attached a couple recent pictures, they still have the yolk sacs but are getting bigger up to around 12mm.

Any thoughts on why they are dying off? The dead ones look the same as the living ones, the same size/shape and amount of yolk sac, just dead.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by Jobro »

Is the one in the breeder doing any better?
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

I forgot to update on that, I actually caught several, around 6 in total, at various stages of development, and put them in the breeder box. The first one died, so I put a fine layer of sand in there before I put any others in, and the remaining fish died over the weekend, some of them did get a white fuzz over them, bacteria or fungus maybe?

I'm not going to interfere any more, and see what happens to the rest, hopefully they will breed again and I will be in a better position to look after them having been through this experience. I hope a few survive, even if it's just one I will be happy!
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

There are no more fry in the cave, and I can only count 4 outside of the cave.

The yolk sacs are almost gone, I think I'll begin targeted feeding in the next day or two, however I suspect that they will be getting enough leftovers from the adults food.

The picture below was taken this morning.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by Uogur »

great result. congratualtions :)
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by watergirluk »

Great new's on the spawn congratualtion's, finger's crossed the ones left do well.
Good luck :-BD
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by brechtvh »

Any update?
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Unfortunately, none of them made it. I'm still hoping one is hiding and will appear from the rocks one day!

The female looks to be gravid and is spending a lot of time outside the males cave, so hopefully they will have another go soon.
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Re: L128 Spawn! (Second spawn!)

Post by MarcW »

Hi All,

When doing a water change this morning I noticed a few fungused yolk sacs were in the waste water.

I took a look in the cave which held the previous spawn, and there are wrigglers in there again. Based on the previous batch, I would guess it has been about 7-10 days since the eggs were laid.

I've not done anything different from last time to encourage a spawn. Last time I was away and didn't do a water change for 2 weeks, and last week I didn't bother doing a water change either. Maybe its a coincidence, or maybe they like to be left alone and combined with worsening water quality that triggers them to spawn?

I'll let everyone know how things progress, there are a lot fewer eggs this time, I would estimate about 15 wrigglers in the cave and 4-5 bad eggs were sucked up this morning during a water change. hopefully the small size of this spawn will increase the odds of some surviving.
2nd batch-1.jpg
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

The young seem to be doing much better this time :-).

There are about 10 hiding in the back of the cave in the small cracks and some on the ceiling. It looks like most of their yolk sacs have been depleted. However the male is still in the cave blocking the exit.

Should I try and poke some food into the cave for them, or hold out for a couple more days and see if the male kicks them out? Hopefully I will be able to get some pictures soon.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

The young are still doing well, and have used all of their yolk sacs. From seeing a small amount of stringy faeces coming from one I guess they have started to feed! I think there are between 6-10 fry, although there are lots of cracks in the roof of the slate cave so its hard to count them.

Most are still in the cave with the male, but I saw one out in the open this morning, and took a couple pictures.

Will the male be allowing them out of the cave to feed? Could they be staying there because it's their cave and they feel safe, so come out to look for food then return?
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

Pleco fry do go out and come back to the cave.... at least at first. They will after a bit stop going back in the cave and find other places to hide. Congratulations on the spawn!!

Chuck
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Thanks Chuck, that's good to hear, I was worried they may be trapped by the male and starve.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

No worries..... if you check after lights off you should find the fry out a lot more than with the lights on too. They are sneaky that way! lol

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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

I am not sure about L128's as I have not had the pleasure of breeding them yet (I've breed a lot of different ones besides L128's) but some pleco fry are very sensitive to sudden changes in the water...... try adding new water slowly to the tank. I have a 5 gallon bucket I put a hole in the bottom/side and adapted a air line to. I put the bucket above the tank and put new water in the bucket..... that way it gravity feeds new water into the tank very slowly. It might be worth a try... and cost very little. All you need is... bucket, air line, air line adaptor, drill and drill bit the size of adaptor. If you want to slow it down even more you could put a valve inline too.... but I never have.

HTH and please keep us informed.
Chuck
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Thanks for the tip, they seem to be ok at the moment, I did a water change yesterday morning of about 75 litres and just used my normal method, a small Eheim pump from a bucket to get the water into the tank.

I do worry about temperature or water parameter changes causing them stress, i'll monitor them and be more careful next time!

As a side note I have kept adult wild caught L128 for several years and they never seem phased by big (50%) sudden water changes sometimes dropping the water temperature by as much as 10 degrees Celsius. That temperature swing is much more than normal, and was after a hot spell when the tank got up to about 32c, usually there is around a 5c drop in temperature when I do a regular change.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

I am glad to hear they are doing well! Whatever you are doing keep it up... it seems to be working!! My advice I give everyone is when you find what works for you and your fish stick to it...... what works for one person may not always work the same for the next person and fish!

Chuck
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

All have left the cave now, I just counted 6 hiding around the tank, there may be a couple more I can't see. They have started to get small blue spots, and appear to be growing.

I haven't target fed them, however every night there is a whole courgette cut in half along the length for the adults, which gets completely stripped of the skin, a couple blocks of Repashy, and some veg/algae tablets, as well as some small granule or flake for the tetras. So far they seem to be finding enough food.

Hopefully they will be in a good enough position for me to take some pictures soon!
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

There are a couple pictures below, poor quality (high iso) as the tank is very dark, and they like to hide in the small gaps, plus its hard to focus on something so small, while holding a torch in the other hand!

Anyway they give you an idea, hopefully when they are slightly bigger I can transfer them to a grow out tank and get some proper pictures.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

Beautiful little ones!! Thanks for the update!!
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

The young still seem to be doing well, they haven't grown much at all though.

The male is sitting on his third lot of eggs now, I spotted them this morning, there seem to be 20-30 eggs, maybe laid a couple days ago.

Hopefully his parenting skills improve further and more survive from this spawn.
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by stuby »

Awesome news! I am glad to hear they are still going at it and the fry are doing well!! To bad you are across the pond from me.... I would love to have some fry from your pair!

Thanks for the update and keep up the good work!!
Chuck
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Re: L128 Spawn!

Post by MarcW »

Thanks, I'm surprised they seem to be breeding so regularly, I've not had this many broods from any type of fish before!
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