PlanetCatfish.com

Shane wrote: ↑30 Oct 2020, 11:01 When I was spawning these regularly I only offered prepared foods once a week. The majority of their diet, as it would be in nature, was driftwood and their bamboo caves. The colony just kept spawning and spawning generation after generation with no "seasonal" changes undertaken by me.
-Shane

Thanks, I will just have to be patient I guess

I have 2 WC L104 ordered from Imperial Tropical coming next week. I unplugged the heater to simulate dry season temperatures. Not sure about at night but the thermometer reads 72F during the day. I will add the 2 new wait a day or so more and then do a large water change and turn the heat on.

Fish arrived safe and sound. I expected both L104s to be in the same bag but they were seperate and double bagged. There was a 7.5mm square of filter foam in each bag too. Floated for 10-15min for temp and then added them to the colony. These guys are small at a shy 30mm, maybe.

Glad you got them safely. Do you have whole body photos yet? I must confess the facial coloration pattern in this pic looks a little peculiar for L104.

Cheers,
Eric

bekateen wrote: ↑03 Dec 2020, 17:34 Glad you got them safely. Do you have whole body photos yet? I must confess the facial coloration pattern in this pic looks a little peculiar for L104.

Cheers,
Eric

I will take some this evening when I get home. I emailed Imperial and the only collection info they have is country of origin, Columbia.

They probably are L104 or at least one of the clown plecos, but it's particularly that area behind the eyes that looks atypical to me.

Cheers, Eric

Made time during lunch to run home and snag some quick pictures. Hopefully to avoid confusing individual specimens I will post seperatly. This is L104 J1

L104 J2, this is the one hiding under the water spike.

Here are all 3 juveniles(J1, J2, J3) in with one of the adults. J3s pictures were to blury.

This is the fish with the odd color pattern. It looks more like a Peckoltia to me. Or if Panaqolus, then one with a very unique and beautiful color pattern.

What do others think? @Acanthicus?
Eric

Here are the 3 little clowns we are discussing I have more pictures from this evening but I will have to sort out who’s who.

They're probably all Panaqolus, but that one is very atypical.

The odd one looks more like LDA 67. They are often mixed in with shipments of P. maccus from Colombia. Nice find. Care conditions for both spp are the same.
-Shane

Shane wrote: ↑04 Dec 2020, 11:44 The odd one looks more like LDA 67. They are often mixed in with shipments of P. maccus from Colombia. Nice find. Care conditions for both spp are the same.
-Shane

Would these cross?

I noticed that under the L104 there aren't any pictures of a male flaring his gill plates to show off his odontids. While snagging the juveniles out of the tank one of my adult males was flaring for me and growling too. I did not test the odontids for ability to puncture human skin

I have no idea if they would cross. I think it doubtful that with adequate mate choices from their own sp they would. But a one off L67 in a tank of all P. maccus might due to a lack of suitable partners. Personally, I would not mix them in a breeding set up. What would be awesome would be to comb through shipments and get groups of both spp set up and spawning.
-Shane

Shane wrote: ↑05 Dec 2020, 13:23 I have no idea if they would cross. I think it doubtful that with adequate mate choices from their own sp they would. But a one off L67 in a tank of all P. maccus might due to a lack of suitable partners. Personally, I would not mix them in a breeding set up. What would be awesome would be to comb through shipments and get groups of both spp set up and spawning.
-Shane

I am considering a call to imperial to see if they would comb through there L104 stock to see if there are any more LDA67. It's a juvie so I at least have some time before spawning even enters its mind Thank you for the answers

After roughly a week of cool 72F temps I plugged the heater back in after a substantial water change. I have also rearranged the caves so some are perpendicular to the tank.
I have seen one male hanging out of a cave but can’t see into it as the chosen cave is one perpendicular to the front.

My spawning tank for these guys looked much like this. They do not need seasonal changes and in the wild spawn year round. I have collected babies in both the wet and dry seasons in Venezuela.
-Shane

Shane wrote: ↑08 Dec 2020, 22:08 My spawning tank for these guys looked much like this. They do not need seasonal changes and in the wild spawn year round. I have collected babies in both the wet and dry seasons in Venezuela.
-Shane

Wow, that's a lot of wood. Do you have caves drilled into those?

I had bamboo and ceramic caves placed throughout the set up. They preferred bamboo but there were spawns in ceramic caves as well. My breeding tank was a 40 breeder with a Marineland Emperor 400 HOB and an extra Marineland 550 powerhead (145 gph) with venturi attached to a sponge pre-filter. So turnover was about 14 times tank volume per hour. Water changes were 50-60% weekly. I just used local tap water which is hard and alkaline (pH 7.6).
I miss living in Washington. In Bellingham we had basically RO water from the tap. It is not lost on me that we see clusters of very successful pleco breeders in parts of the world with high quality soft water on tap.
-Shane

Hmm, I will try to learn patience. If they don't care about seasonal changes or water parameters then I should be seeing babies like crazy.

I have a significant snail invasion in the L104 tank. I do not feed prepared foods regularly as there are multiple alder logs for them to chew on. I am considering dosing copper in the tank to destroy the snails. Would this have an adverse effect on the L104?

I am not a fan. Check out this link

http://help.bioworldusa.com/kb/algae-tr ... ic-to-fish

Additionally a sudden massive die off of snails can pollute a tank very quickly (even if the fish survive the treatment, which is known to be particularly hard on scaleless fishes).

Have you tried snail traps or assassin snails? Assassin snails can easily bloom to the point of a plague, but at least they are easy to sell.
-Shane

Shane wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 21:10 I am not a fan. Check out this link

http://help.bioworldusa.com/kb/algae-tr ... ic-to-fish

Additionally a sudden massive die off of snails can pollute a tank very quickly (even if the fish survive the treatment, which is known to be particularly hard on scaleless fishes).

Have you tried snail traps or assassin snails? Assassin snails can easily bloom to the point of a plague, but at least they are easy to sell.
-Shane

I know to dose half dose in freshwater but I did not know about the alkalinity of the water effecting the interaction. I have added 4 baby assassins to the tank. I haven't tried traps but I do pull the logs out of the tank periodically and wipe the snails off. I have 5 pea puffers I can move in there too which would give them a fast food restaurant buffet

If you can find or order one of these, get it. They are amazingly efficient and collecting a lot of snails:



https://www.sera.de/us/product/freshwat ... l-collect/

I rarely see them for sale in the USA. I've been told by people who should know that Sera does not market them in the USA because they fall under the category of pest control (which includes poisons) and are thus hamstrung by too much US govt regulation.

However, I've also spoken to a person who works in one of the offices of the US Govt that does oversee regulation of pest control chemicals and they swear these do not fall under US govt regulations/oversight.

I stumbled upon one in a Las Vegas, NV local fish store last year for about $20USD. Best $20 I ever spent... on snail control at least.

Cheers, Eric

P.S.

Shane wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 21:10Have you tried snail traps or assassin snails? Assassin snails can easily bloom to the point of a plague, but at least they are easy to sell.
-Shane

I really like assassin snails. I've bought or traded to get dozens over the years. Somehow, though, they die in my tanks without their eggs hatching successfully (I find eggs but never find baby assassins). I wish I knew why not.

Thanks, I do too. We really need a "like" button.

fishguy1978 wrote: ↑06 Jan 2021, 03:38We really need a "like" button.

Been there. Thought that.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=41404

bekateen wrote: ↑06 Jan 2021, 05:23

fishguy1978 wrote: ↑06 Jan 2021, 03:38We really need a "like" button.

Been there. Thought that.

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=41404

Whew, thanks.

Awesome thread! I love those alder cone caves! I'm gonna get some myself!
I did a search and can't seem to find alder caves or nice bamboo caves in the USA.