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Hello friend!

Starting to get crazy about this Pleco fishes and considering to customize a 4ft tank with the following dimension:

4ft(L) x 1ft(H) x 1ft(W) and water ~ 101 litres (27 gal)

Is this okay for keep varous type of Pleco? As I understand that Pleco do not require Height but a long tank should be prefered?

Anyone ??

Here are (2) popular sizes available in the United States.

1. 55 gallons: 12" deep x 48" long x 20" high. This size is very, very popular. There are many stands available for this tank here.

2. 75 gallons: 18" deep x 48" long x 20" high. This size is also popular and has stands available.

I have no idea what is available to you in Singapore. Maybe somebody from Europe could list the most popular sizes from where they live? I wonder if the Jewel tanks are available in Singapore?

Tanks in the UK (which is part of europe, but also different because although the country is officially metric, a lot of measures are still in imperial measures, or derived from them).

So, "domestically produced" tanks tend to be in feet and inches, whilst imports from europe, for instance Juwel (German), are in metric measures.

Generally, you can buy tanks from either manufacturer in a variety of dimensions. Some popular sizes are:

gallons are US gallons, imperial gallons are 20% bigger.

Length x Width(depth) x Height
80cm(32") x 30 (12") x 40 (15") ~ 100 liter/25 gal.
80cm(32") x 35 (14") x 45 (17") ~ 127 liter/30 gal.
100cm(40")x 35 (14") x 45 (17") ~ 160 liter/40 gal.
120cm(48")x 35 (14") x 45 (17") ~ 190 liter/50 gal.
120cm(60")x 50 (20") x 60 (24") ~ 300 liter/75 gal.
150cm(60")x 50 (20") x 60 (24") ~ 400 liter/100 gal.

I suspect that the Far East uses some similar standard measueres.

There are some advantages with building your own tank, and there are some with buying one ready made. In the far east, like Singapore, the labor cost is much lower than in Europe/US, so the extra cost of having a custom size tank is probably less...

But it's still more awkward to have a custom made tank, because everything around it needs to be custom made too, unless you use a standard measurement so that the hood and stand (for example) are "standard size".

Further, I'm not entirely sure what the point of making a "low" tank is. Sure the pleco's don't need deep water, but there's really little to be gained from NOT keeping it deep. One immediate drawback would be the lower volume which causes less dilution of any "dirt" produced by the fish... A 200 liter tank can take two times more pollution than a 100 liter tank.

--
Mats

what you really want for plecos is the maximum substate (or bottom) area. having a tank that is say 4ft(L) X 1.5ft(H) X 2ft(W) will let you have many more plecos than the tank you propose, and won't be much larger.

An interesting "factoid" is that US tanks are the sizes they are to save on shipping rates. Two 5 gallons fit in two 10s, two tens in two 15s, two 15s in one 45. The two 15s can be substituted for two 20 "highs" and then shipped in a 55. This is one reason why the common tank sizes are popular. They are popular because they are cheaper due to money saved on shipping costs. This is why uncommon tanks, like the 40 gallon "breeder" or a hex tank, are so much more expensive. Also, the gallon sizes on U.S. tanks are not accurate. Measure your tank and do the math. A U.S. 55 gallon actually holds 49 gallons.
-Shane

Why am I not surprised. I was wondering why the warehouse pet places sell a 10 gallon tank for $10, but sell a 5 gallon tank for $18.

Bronzefry wrote:Here are (2) popular sizes available in the United States.

1. 55 gallons: 12" deep x 48" long x 20" high. This size is very, very popular. There are many stands available for this tank here.

2. 75 gallons: 18" deep x 48" long x 20" high. This size is also popular and has stands available.

I have no idea what is available to you in Singapore. Maybe somebody from Europe could list the most popular sizes from where they live? I wonder if the Jewel tanks are available in Singapore?

There are full range of Jewel tank and products selling in Singapore. The popular size is very similar to your 55 gallons tank mentioned here.

The reason I opt for custom made 4ft tank, becausse it gives you a little more 'creative in designing your tank' (or one of the kind ). I was thinking to have a low tank to go with my home decor (The landscape look) and it will be very unique . But after hearing various members comments, apparently it would not be practical. In Singapore, the price different between the standard dimension and custom made is not much.

Actually, I like the idea Racoll suggested that the maximum substate (bottom area) with the dimension of 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft (W) and would probably house more Pleco. A quick water volume calculation for this tank with 95% full would approx. be 322 litres (86 gal). That's a lot of water. Almost 3 times the water volume that my initial planned tank size of 4ft x 1ft x 1ft.

The 2ft wide tank, good thinking!

Star-flog wrote:Actually, I like the idea Racoll suggested that the maximum substate (bottom area) with the dimension of 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft (W) and would probably house more pl*co. A quick water volume calculation for this tank with 95% full would approx. be 322 litres (86 gal). That's a lot of water. Almost 3 times the water volume that my initial planned tank size of 4ft x 1ft x 1ft.

The 2ft wide tank, good thinking!

It really should be 3x the water volume (4 x 1 x 1 = 4, 4 x 1.5 x 2 = 12, 12/4 = 3)... Or simpler: 1.5 x 2 = 3

I think that's a good size, and it gives you decent height, good floor area...

--
Mats

Sure, the tank size is good and now the question is how expensive to make this 4ft tank ?

Also, I would probably go for all woods 'decoration' instead of River bank type. Thinking its more cool looking. Same color throughtout and perhaps equip with moonlighting...no plants.

Nevertheless, I read some people goes for River bank type. Is there any reason and which one is better and why ?

Star-flog wrote:Sure, the tank size is good and now the question is how expensive to make this 4ft tank ?

Also, I would probably go for all woods 'decoration' instead of River bank type. Thinking its more cool looking. Same color throughtout and perhaps equip with moonlighting...no plants.

Nevertheless, I read some people goes for River bank type. Is there any reason and which one is better and why ?

There are several reasons to choose one design from another. You have to compromise between several things:
1. Try to reproduce the exact environment that the fish lives in.
This is of course ultimately not possible, as most fish live in big bodies of water, not a 100-300 liter puddle.
There are other difficulties too, the water may contain a lot of big rocks, which wouldn't fit well in the tank, or have a muddy bottom that is half a meter/2ft of mulch.

2. Try to make it pretty.
In general, we want our fish-tanks to look pretty, at least if it's located in a "common" area of the house. Having something that looks like a minature of a timber logjam is probably not the most attractive thing. Same with having water that looks like milky tea or weak coffee. You want to be able to see the fish, at least when they are at the front of the tank.

3. Try to make it affordable.
If you're a millionare, this isn't an issue. For most other people, there is a limit on how much you want to spend on the decorations.

--
Mats

Thanks for the experience sharing, I learnt something really useful today.

Based on your mentioned points, I would go for all woods decoration and would learn a bit of art of woods arrangement. It probably takes a while to collect (or buy) those driftwoods to my liking.

Thanks a million times once again and much appreciated.

Pleco is now my first love, planted tank the second & my wife the third ! Hahah...

MatsP wrote:

Star-flog wrote:Actually, I like the idea Racoll suggested that the maximum substate (bottom area) with the dimension of 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft (W) and would probably house more pl*co. A quick water volume calculation for this tank with 95% full would approx. be 322 litres (86 gal). That's a lot of water. Almost 3 times the water volume that my initial planned tank size of 4ft x 1ft x 1ft.

The 2ft wide tank, good thinking!

It really should be 3x the water volume (4 x 1 x 1 = 4, 4 x 1.5 x 2 = 12, 12/4 = 3)... Or simpler: 1.5 x 2 = 3

I think that's a good size, and it gives you decent height, good floor area...

--
Mats

Hi all, I checked the custom made price in LFS (Singapore) and following just for reference and further comments:-

1) 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 1.5ft(W): Water Volume 255L/67G = ~US$90
2) 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2.0ft(W): Water Volume 340L/90G = ~US$125
3) 5ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2.0ft(W): Water Volume 425L/112G = ~US$190
All above is using 10mm thickness float glass, rimless and open-top tank design.

Is the price reasonable compared to your area?
If you were me, which one would you go for?

Star-flog wrote:Hi all, I checked the custom made price in LFS (Singapore) and following just for reference and further comments:-

1) 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 1.5ft(W): Water Volume 255L/67G = ~US$90
2) 4ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2.0ft(W): Water Volume 340L/90G = ~US$125
3) 5ft(L) x 1.5ft(H) x 2.0ft(W): Water Volume 425L/112G = ~US$190
All above is using 10mm thickness float glass, rimless and open-top tank design.

Is the price reasonable compared to your area?
If you were me, which one would you go for?

It's pretty pointless to compare prices between regions, at least on large fish-tanks that cost an enormous amount to ship (because of size and weight). If you could (for sake of argument) buy a 400L tank of the size you want in a shop here in England for half the price of the same tank in Singapore, you still wouldn't do that, because you'd loose all of that saving and more again to ship it across the world.

Having said that, it seems to be pretty decent prices to me.

Which you should choose is completely up to you. Depends on a lot of things, including what space you're going to put it in, how much money you want to spend, etc, etc.

--
Mats

Hi Mats, of course shipping a tank is very expensive unless the saving really worth it. Those figures are purely information.

I think I would go for 5ft tank...well may be for a little stretch even consider to go to 6ft(L)x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft(W), water volume of 510L/135G. If not, I might regret it later not having a bigger tank.

That what the experience breeder here advised before... go for the bigger tank possible.

Star-flog wrote:Hi Mats, of course shipping a tank is very expensive unless the saving really worth it. Those figures are purely information.

I think I would go for 5ft tank...well may be for a little stretch even consider to go to 6ft(L)x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft(W), water volume of 510L/135G. If not, I might regret it later not having a bigger tank.

That what the experience breeder here advised before... go for the bigger tank possible.

Bigger tank isn't necessarily better. As an option, think of two smaller tanks.

The advantage with several tanks is that you can keep fish that aren't necessarily wanting the same environment, such as one type wanting really flowing water, and another wanting a more quite water environment.

I've got a 5ft(l) x 2ft (h) x 1ft 8in (w), and it's great. But sometimes I wish I had another tank...

--
Mats

MatsP wrote:

Star-flog wrote:Hi Mats, of course shipping a tank is very expensive unless the saving really worth it. Those figures are purely information.

I think I would go for 5ft tank...well may be for a little stretch even consider to go to 6ft(L)x 1.5ft(H) x 2ft(W), water volume of 510L/135G. If not, I might regret it later not having a bigger tank.

That what the experience breeder here advised before... go for the bigger tank possible.

Bigger tank isn't necessarily better. As an option, think of two smaller tanks.

The advantage with several tanks is that you can keep fish that aren't necessarily wanting the same environment, such as one type wanting really flowing water, and another wanting a more quite water environment.

I've got a 5ft(l) x 2ft (h) x 1ft 8in (w), and it's great. But sometimes I wish I had another tank...

--
Mats

Hi Mats, your reply is absolutely fast and again, thanks for the comment.

Space can be a little constraint here in my place. Actually, I have already got 3 tanks:
1) 3ft fully planted tank
2) 1ft cube planted tank
3) 2ft Pleco tank
4) 2ft cube planted tank (Customs made and to be delivered)
5) To be decided.. 5ft or 6ft Pleco tank (got to ask my wife permission..haha.. )

For some strange reasons, I now love Pleco! To be honest, these fishes are not particularly good looking but we love them.

Why ?

matsp has a good point, but i would get the biggest one you can afford. just think how many fish you can keep in a 6 footer!! you can also keep the larger plecos that you normaly woudn't think about.

as far as decorations go, i always work backwards.

by this i mean, i choose the fish i want to keep , then choose the decor to fit in with them.

species like panaque need lots of wood to eat, so i would fill the tank with wood for them.

species like hypancistrus live in rocky rivers so i would just have rocks.

of course the hypancistrus aren't going to drop dead in a bogwood filled tank (mine are fine), but they won't be so happy in a heavily planted tank. so think of the fish first!

i don't like tanks with a little bit of this and a little bit of that, like a few plants, a lump of bogwood and a couple of pebbles. the tank needs to be functional and look striking i think.

racoll wrote:matsp has a good point, but i would get the biggest one you can afford. just think how many fish you can keep in a 6 footer!! you can also keep the larger pl*cos that you normaly woudn't think about.

as far as decorations go, i always work backwards.

by this i mean, i choose the fish i want to keep , then choose the decor to fit in with them.

species like panaque need lots of wood to eat, so i would fill the tank with wood for them.

species like hypancistrus live in rocky rivers so i would just have rocks.

of course the hypancistrus aren't going to drop dead in a bogwood filled tank (mine are fine), but they won't be so happy in a heavily planted tank. so think of the fish first!

i don't like tanks with a little bit of this and a little bit of that, like a few plants, a lump of bogwood and a couple of pebbles. the tank needs to be functional and look striking i think.

Well, I fully agree with you in regards to specially designed Pleco tank with the end purpose in mind...

Actually, I saw a beautiful Royal Pleco (L027C) at my friend's place some week ago. This Royal Pleco is so beautiful, its got the unique gold-line/green combination just 'strike' me. Therefore I was thinking ever since, to build a tank that house few variety of Royal Pleco and would focus on all driftwood tank decoration !

Additionally, I kind of like the river idea and thinking whether the driftwood and river decor in one tank would work ? Would it look odd?

I think a river/bogwood tank is a fantastic idea, when I move I may just attempt something similar, keeping all current loving panaque and pekolita sp. It could be set up so that the bogwood provides a few calmer areas for respite. I just got two used 802 powerheads that would just about do the trick. The subtrate could be a nice mix of river sand/pea gravel with a few larger stones, tree roots attatched to the rim of the tank could act as a sort of riverbank biotope...oh man i love this hobby!!

Star-flog wrote:Well, I fully agree with you in regards to specially designed pl*co tank with the end purpose in mind...

Actually, I saw a beautiful Royal pl*co (L027C) at my friend's place some week ago. This Royal pl*co is so beautiful, its got the unique gold-line/green combination just 'strike' me. Therefore I was thinking ever since, to build a tank that house few variety of Royal pl*co and would focus on all driftwood tank decoration !

Additionally, I kind of like the river idea and thinking whether the driftwood and river decor in one tank would work ? Would it look odd?

Bear in mind that big Panaque sp like L027 do grow VERY BIG. They are very beautiful, but they need bigger tank than you suggest. Something in the order of 500gal/2000 liter would probably be sufficient. With a max length of about 40-50 cm[1], and a good apetite to chew on wood, they will need a big tank with very good filtration.

[1] 50 cm length means a tank that is about 2m x 1m x 1m => 2000 liter, minimum. You could perhaps get away with a little bit less depth and thus a bit less volume, but it certainly needs to be bigger than 1000 liter.

--
Mats

MatsP wrote:

Star-flog wrote:Well, I fully agree with you in regards to specially designed pl*co tank with the end purpose in mind...

Actually, I saw a beautiful Royal pl*co (L027C) at my friend's place some week ago. This Royal pl*co is so beautiful, its got the unique gold-line/green combination just 'strike' me. Therefore I was thinking ever since, to build a tank that house few variety of Royal pl*co and would focus on all driftwood tank decoration !

Additionally, I kind of like the river idea and thinking whether the driftwood and river decor in one tank would work ? Would it look odd?

Bear in mind that big Panaque sp like L027 do grow VERY BIG. They are very beautiful, but they need bigger tank than you suggest. Something in the order of 500gal/2000 liter would probably be sufficient. With a max length of about 40-50 cm[1], and a good apetite to chew on wood, they will need a big tank with very good filtration.

[1] 50 cm length means a tank that is about 2m x 1m x 1m => 2000 liter, minimum. You could perhaps get away with a little bit less depth and thus a bit less volume, but it certainly needs to be bigger than 1000 liter.

--
Mats

Wow, it looks like keeping of Royal Pleco is a 'tough-job' and it's nearly impossible to have a 2m tank in my place. I can't imagine having a "mini-swimming pool" in the middle of the living room.

Okay, it's about time to go back to the drawing board and think really carefully...

natefrog wrote:I think a river/bogwood tank is a fantastic idea, when I move I may just attempt something similar, keeping all current loving panaque and pekolita sp. It could be set up so that the bogwood provides a few calmer areas for respite. I just got two used 802 powerheads that would just about do the trick. The subtrate could be a nice mix of river sand/pea gravel with a few larger stones, tree roots attatched to the rim of the tank could act as a sort of riverbank biotope...oh man i love this hobby!!

I don't know whether this would work but having river/driftwood tank can be quite difficult to achieve, if one wants to obtain the satisfactory result!
Nevertheless, the fun part begins when you start to toy with the idea... the process is the most enjoyment part of this whole "business".

Have Fun !