PlanetCatfish.com

[Mod edit: Broken out from here: http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =2&t=32255 --Mats]

Hi L#Banana,

What's with the avatar change?? From cute to sinister? From cudly to frightening? From fuzzy to don't-know-what-to-expect-from-that?


Sorry about a real late feedback. Two weeks of house-hunting in FL and the aftermath have taken their toll on my time and focus.

LNB: I just clued in that you were thinking of keeping the big fish in Florida! I was thinking your fish destination was in NY around the corner of the lake from me. Where would your 'little' fish go? NY or Florida?

VJ: We are moving to Naples, FL Mar 15, 2011. The Rochester house will be up for sale late spring. All fish will have to endure a 24-h ride after I prep a temporary home for them in Naples. We are starting our own business: Aquarium-Bot.-Garden type. Yeah, I know, talk about stupid...

LNB: ... ponds with a glass wall,
That's my plans too! I think what I will have to do is build a step down from my deck and have "ground level" pond on the higher deck with the look-see part on the lower deck. A glass shop can tell you about the pressure you need for the volume of water. At that thickness, it seems plexiglass type stuff and tempered glass start to cost about the same. They make steel 'U' shaped pieces that you can slide the 'glass' into. Foam/silicon around the edges and bob's your uncle I'll set the steel into a cement form and build the frame like a hot tub frame for the other sides. I can get used bus shelter tempered from the city for cheap but I would have to put up with a blue line across the middle.

VJ: sounds nice! Did you check u-tube? Lots of videos of final products like that but not much teach how to build them. BTW: I love the bus idea. I love anything unusual and anything that blows away people who do not expect.

LNB: I have to seriously look at a three-sides black-out test aquarium to figure out which way will be the best viewing and also would a south-side window be too algae covered.

Things I'm also thinking about with that particular build: Do I install a light of some kind for special viewing evenings? What colour should I make the substrate etc, black rubber may end up being a little disappointing but at the same time something dark will probably make the fish more comfortable. Do I make the pond include solar tubes to keep the water warm enough when it's freezing temps or stick with a strong bubbler? The solar tubes would be initially cheaper to install. If I do all that should I make two glass sides and have one side viewable from the small basement window? Hmm.

VJ: lighting is good. Have you been to public Aquaria recently? One can get lots of ideas from there. I love going to such, have been to most of them on the US east coast from NY to FL keys.

LNB: I keep telling The Bigger Half that I'm saving on the cost of buying a humidifier

VJ: it is only $100 and worth its weight in Aurum (gold).

Update, Jan 26 2011.

Well, the Rochester era is almost over for us. The things awaiting us right ahead include
-- forming our own corporation,
-- getting licenses,
-- moving the whole operation and ourselves to Naples, FL within 2 months,
-- fixing up current house and selling it,
-- fixing the new 8.4 acre property and the 6000 sg feet of the new living space and 2000 sq ft of screened-in lanais,
-- cleaning 5 ponds totaling ~1.5 acre, and
-- starting/building up our own business (Aquarium-Bot.-Garden, of all things...), of which building the exhibits will matter and take the most, of course.

The cats and Co. are still much, much wanted but now, with any luck, they will pay for our living instead of vice verse... fool's dreams die hard... usually after the owner...

Wow!!!!

Things are really going big time.

Best wishes for success in your big move.

lol, in the eyes of most people you should be on the show animal hoarders, but in my eyes you will see only envy and jealousy

loving every gallon of it great set up

Thanks much, Arapaimag, that means a lot.

Yeah, Nicofish, alongside those people whose houses are overrun by like 300 some cats... Thanks for the compliment, good to be not alone...

L#Banana, you might wanna take a peek at this web site, found by Mats. It is beyond excellent and may assist in your thinking about pond+glass-window building.

http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy ... itres.html

[Mod edit: Fix link --Mats]

Hi Viktor

What's with the avatar change?? From cute to sinister? From cudly to frightening? From fuzzy to don't-know-what-to-expect-from-that?

Just giving my other cat some web time. She was in front of the pellet stove so that's why she looked so threatening. She's really the sucky one of the family I've changed it to Spooky again sitting in his normal flop-over-something position.

Anyway, long time no hear from. Lots going on here. The Bigger Half has been recovering from spine surgery and has moved to using a cane only occasionally so things are looking up and he seems to like that pond link you posted He may not be a fish-head like myself but he's getting all twitchy wanting to pick up his tools again. Looks like that sort of project will work nicely!

We are starting our own business: Aquarium-Bot.-Garden type. Yeah, I know, talk about stupid...

No! Not stupid at all! When the economy is down people tend to spend money on home based things and as the population is aging so the gardening sector is growing. Once people have planted ponds, they need the fish to complete the picture.

Can I offer a bit of advice? You probably already know all this but you can't hear this enough either:
Business plan - spend the time to do it and stick with it and modify only as needed.
Research the crap out of the services already there and find your niche.
Have business cards in wallet and purse always (I got caught out all the time and finally smartened up!)
Make friends with your banker!!! Big one, there's help for every aspect from business plan to financing.
Consult (free initial consultation) a small business lawyer for advice re insurance. Do that part before you open the doors.
Be sweet to your competitors, your product/service will speak for itself.
Knock on the door of every free business consultation place. We have an economic development bureau, a small business org, a business development bank etc. Press the flesh and go to every small business seminar/lunch etc you can find.
One more - play golf...pathetic but most of my quilting lessons come via the golf course. And I HATE golf.
I'm still running my wee business and it kept me afloat since June 1st when we became a one paycheque family (temporary, thank god). These boring old basic rules still work.
Serving you since 1993 Not rich but I can eat and I bought a house - so far so good.

I'm so excited for you!!
Will you be selling online wee orchids with the phytosanitary certificates included? If so, feel free to PM me. Florida is crack to a plant-aholic like me.

Glad to hear life is being good to you, cool. And don't forget to document the fish transport

I'm designing a fish transport unit for my motorbike. Something that I can plug into the battery like a hot suit but it has to be stable enough not to joggle the fish around. Will need to test it somehow. Don't want to sacrifice any poor little fish. Any ideas? I think a backpack would be the quietest for the fish but I really don't know if it will even be possible.
It may be that I'll time my little expeditions to coincide with the time the Bigger Half gets off work and call him in as the cavalry for the fish. Good in theory but that limits the rivers I can check out.

Hope you're all tucked in for the coming storm! Yikes, 14+ inches!!? I brought a shovel inside so I can at least get out the door when it gets here.

L number Banana wrote:Just giving my other cat some web time.

a-ah, an equal opportunity feline owner... how sweet

L number Banana wrote:he seems to like that pond link you posted

to Mats' credit, not mine

L number Banana wrote:they need the fish to complete the picture.

There must be something I am saying wrong: every person I say/write to that I would like to start an Aquarium business or I would like to build an Aquarium thinks I plan to raise and sell fish. Maybe you could tell me why that is... Anyway, no, no selling fish, no selling plants (not intentionally anyway). The idea is in the ichthyo analog of a zoo. Big exhibits, big fish from all 5 continents, beautiful park/garden - charge admission. http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... 8&start=60

So what words should I use to convey this idea to people in one short sentence?

Thanks so much for the advices and the sentiments.

L number Banana wrote:I'm designing a fish transport unit for my motorbike.

Well, from my limited understanding, my bike friends tell me that the two-wheelers are sensitive to balance. That is why bikers train first to ride with two riders, especially the curves - it is far from trivial and the stakes are... well, high. Water sloshing around in the carriage may cause you to lose your balance in a way similar to person sitting in the back and doing his/her balancing act. You might wanna consider attaching a cart and making it a three-wheeler, throwing a rubber liner in the cart and you are golden - you got yourself an ichthyo-friendly motobike

Na-ah, 14"? It's peanuts. We get lake effect snow all the time - nobody would be getting any snow past 20 miles away from the Lake and we would get pounded with a foot many many times over winter. Such is life. Some assembly (or shoveling) required.

Viktor Jarikov wrote:

L number Banana wrote:I'm designing a fish transport unit for my motorbike.

Well, from my limited understanding, my bike friends tell me that the two-wheelers are sensitive to balance. That is why bikers train first to ride with two riders, especially the curves - it is far from trivial and the stakes are... well, high. Water sloshing around in the carriage may cause you to lose your balance in a way similar to person sitting in the back and doing his/her balancing act. You might wanna consider attaching a cart and making it a three-wheeler, throwing a rubber liner in the cart and you are golden - you got yourself an ichthyo-friendly motobike

I wouldn't think it's a huge problem to transport small numbers of medium sized fish, or moderate numbers of smaller fish, on a motorbike.

I'm not really sure what you mean by "train first to ride with two riders". Certainly in this country, riders train on their own bike as a single rider, and only later on when you have passed your test are you allowed/supposed to carry a pillion passenger.

A passenger leaning the wrong way on a corner can indeed affect the balance of the bike. A "sloshy fish transporter" is much less likely to "sit up" [1] during a cornering situation - and even a large fish-transporter is unlikely to contain more than about 10-15 gal of water, which is a lot less than a fully grown human.

[1] Meaning the passenger doesn't like the way the bike leans so far over, and tries to compensate, making the bike take a different line on the corner. As bikes turn mainly based on lean, and very little through handle-bar-pointing, it affects the cornering quite dramatically. The way that two-wheeled tyres are designed, with a semi-circular profile, the edge of the tyre is a smaller diameter than the middle. If you take a plastic (or paper) drinks-cup, laying on it's side, and roll it, you'll see how it rolls in a circle. Motorcycle tyres work along the same principle when the bike is leaning. If the bike isn't leaning, then it goes in a straight line.

Here's a shot of Scott Redding displaying the technique of leaning in corners:


--
Mats

@ Viktor

when i was in the trade, we once got in an "asian swap eel" - haven't a clue what it was scientifically. 5 foot long, resembling a brown conger eel (a native UK marine eel), and one mean, aggressive individual that i'm sure viewed me and my fingers as a "lite-bite" (never put hands in the tank for this one & i've tempted fate with many species). Also never seen one again. The cover glasses to the tank gave a 100% tight closure and were weighted down by a number of housebricks.....still this did not stop it going walkies one day......oh the trouble he caused us to find him!

Guys, thanks for the biking 101 and eel-keeping 101, respectively.

So what words should I use to convey this idea to people in one short sentence?

Hmm, I see. Aquarium business does sound like you're selling fish so I guess we would have to be looking for new words and certainly you have it right that you need to be able to describe it in one concise sentence(page 2 on the business plan - Executive Summary).
What are other places like that? 'Theme Park' is too kitchy and not educational. Botanical garden and aquascape is too plantish and doesn't emphasize the fish.....hmm.

Garden as the first part of the name/description attracts more people (more gardeners than fish people per capita.) So maybe something like:
Naples Garden and Aquarium offers guided and self guided tours through their elegantly landscaped grounds and aquariums showcasing large exotic fish from all five continents.

Weak parts are the words "large" and "elegantly" but use those two spots to point out your niche. If you have say catfish from each continent use that as the catch...large catfish and other exotic.....
Same for "elegantly", say if your niche is scented plants or miniature orchids put that in plus the fact that there s more as well...guided tours through their beautifully landscaped gardens including the secret miniature orchid garden....

Use the sentence to help to answer your five w's and the h that you need for the business plan.
Who: tourists, gardeners, fish fans, large fish fans, catfish fans, orchid nuts...wheelchair accessible (seniors$$), benches to rest in the gardens?
Why: because guided tours are available as well as self guided and tours are guided by fishkeeper with xx experience and xx years of pond keeping etc etc.
Where: Naples, FL
When: From dawn to dusk - Tueday - Saturday or whatever. Open for private tours only during December etc etc??
What: botanical garden specializing in XXX, large exotic fish from all continents.
How: Easy to get to, offering parking/bus routes, safe exhibits for kids blah,blah.

Is there another word for self guided?? that sounds funny.
What's your niche? are all the fish huge, what's the 'coolest' fish according to regular folk? Any particular slant to your planting ideas?
Don't forget to make lots of brochures for the tourist places - including the American embassy here. TONS of Canadian flock south every winter. Your business is not a business, it's a "destination."

WRT the motorbike lean etc, let me add to MatsP's info, this is another cool way to understand it as explained to me - think of a motorcycle wheel as an inverted screw head or mushroom. The part that touches the road is larger on the sides (during a lean) than it is being upright so steering with the body works better than steering with the bars. Remember riding a bike with no hands? Lean yourself to turn it.
I have no intention of taking passengers anytime soon, if ever - yikes. My only potential passenger someday is 310 lbs and I'm about 130 so I would be in a perpetual wheelie on such a small bike!
I'm more worried about the water sloshing out if I have to stop suddenly so I need the fish-unit to be self contained. My cycling course includes a part where you learn to ride so smoothly that you don't spill the glass of water taped to your gastank!!That includes corners.

Just passed my written knowledge test and my three day course starts April 1st, next course is in June and track course is July ))
Viktor, if you need a third set of eyes to proofread your business stuff or brochures etc, PM me, I love doing that sort of thing.

MatsP:

Certainly in this country, riders train on their own bike as a single rider, and only later on when you have passed your test are you allowed/supposed to carry a pillion passenger.

Yup, same here. I wouldn't be allowed to carry a passenger until I've taken the first two courses/road tests but see above - I won't be taking any passengers other than fish.

A "sloshy fish transporter" is much less likely to "sit up"

If it does, I should run away as I've caught something too large for my tank. heehee

Good explanation as usual and nice pic.

Richard B: re the eel

....still this did not stop it going walkies one day......

I can see the Far Side cartoon in my head

Here goes my pathetic attempt at loosely, very loosely keeping to the thread title:

Richard B wrote:The cover glasses to the tank gave a 100% tight closure and were weighted down by a number of housebricks.....still this did not stop it going walkies one day......

There is a popular saying in Russian involving a one-eyed baby and seven nannies... It was a store with many employees and visitors, right? Could it simply had been that some one moved the brick(s) or forgot to put a couple back or missed one glass cover, etc.? Still, if the 5-ft eel could stretch from the bottom to the glass covers, he could lean against the bottom and lift the cover even with the weights on. 5-ft is a monster and these guys are incredibly strong, like snakes, one solid muscle. Once there is a crack and his head is in, their slipperiness comes in very handy and off they go.


L#Banana, thanks so much for your care and help.

Balaji (aka Shovelnose) suggested Monster, Inc.

The name is IchthyoPark, Inc. We already got it approved by the state of FL. The marketing slogan I am pondering: "Come see the biggest collection of the biggest freshwater fish".

The trick is not to turn out a liar cuz' I'd rather, much rather we fail than lie. Yeah, likely within 1 year this slogan will not be even close to true but I think and hope within 2-3 years, it should become true or close to it. Then we could use it. Until then, it should have an "in progress" tack-on in real tiny print

See, the biggest collection (in the world or in US or in FL, by implication, choose one) of the biggest f.-w. fish (in the world) is a tricky slogan:
-- first of all, we are talking about a publicly accessible collection;
-- second, you don't have to have more fish than any other Aquarium (which as a norm have both marine and f.-w.), just more of the (biologically) largest species,
-- or more of the largest specimen of the largest species, to remain truthful and make this marketing claim, which I think would be very attractive to a wide audience, much wider than animal lovers, fish-keeping hobbyists, kids, and anglers - I am aiming at people looking to relax and kill a couple of hours of leisure time - that's by far the biggest customer base at a resort place like Naples with >1,000,000 tourists yearly, most of which are wealthy.
-- according to our research based on vising loads of public Aquaria and zoos, ~50%-70% of the fish we intend to display cannot be seen anywhere else in the US public Aquaria and zoos and another ~10%-20% can be seen very rarely. If we are lucky, we can push this number to 90%.

Gardens and aquatic gardens and koi ponds are thought to be just a backdrop, so we are not catering to the gardeners in the first place. My MPH (Much Prettier Half) is into cacti and succulents and has a nice collection of those of her own. Besides, Naples has a nice Bot. Garden but there is no Aquarium in the 50-100 mile radius.

Lots to think about, If I can get my mind off your Prettier Half's plants!! Drool. I would visit a garden specializing in Cacti and succulents!

second, you don't have to have more fish than any other Aquarium (which as a norm have both marine and f.-w.), just more of the (biologically) largest species,

I think 'biggest' this or that might make people think about 9 metre long fish or Dubai style aquariums 'cause the average tourist might not know those legalities.

The tag line to Ichthyopark tells non-fish people that Ichthyo- is about fish and that's helpful.

On the funny side, I thought about these:
Ichthyopark - the monsterfish your mother warned you about.
Ichthyopark - Fish with attitude.
heehee!

Going out to shovel...

Going out to shovel...

Poor you...we have a Chinook moving in...yahoo!!!

Birger

Lucky you! Enjoy for the rest of us please
I just had the snow plow push a giant ice boulder from the street to the middle of the driveway... Moved it back out to the edge of the roadway by using my ice chopper as a prybar and rolling it, so maybe they will move it a little father down on the next pass.

If it doesn't get moved far enough to get the truck by, it'll be power tool time!! I'll stand on it first, take a picture and send it with a thank you note to the mayor...

I can't winge about my storm when I think about Australia...back to counting blessings and shoveling.