My Public Aquarium: exhibit blues - how to make them?

[Viktor Jarikov]

Hi All,

An updated scoop.

I am working on a start-up, Public Fresh Water Aquarium in Naples, FL. Nothing fancy – pretty much an extended hobby at this point - a 1-2 people, family business. Hopefully, eventually a $50,000-$100,000 annual revenue operation. No building but an array of free-standing, above-ground fish tanks in a 55'x55' screened-in lanai. Concrete, clay-tiled slab for the floor. Tarp or thin metal roof, roll-down plastic curtains for the side walls for colder times. Heavily shaded.

No marine fish, only fresh water and some brackish. I intend to display the largest fresh water fish there is (90% are 2' adult size and longer) from all five continents and pay great attention to the educational side of the business in addition to the obvious entertaining side. The vast majority of the fish are catfish and odd balls - arowanas, pacus, giant gouramis, gars, various carp, koi, eels, arapaimas, Nile perch, bass, sturgeon - stuff like that.

I intend to employ no heating or cooling of the water and no bio-filtering – it's a flow-through system: one pipe in and one pipe out and perhaps a few bubblers to keep the tanks well aerated and stirred. That's it. No furniture in the tanks except for a few sticks/tree trunks of driftwood, maybe. No gravel/sand (in my experience with large tanks/ponds, it does more harm than good by accumulating fish waste).

The exhibit water temp is about 80-82 F for the hottest months of the year and about 68-70 F for the coldest.

The incoming water is at ~74 F year round. It is a mix of my raw, low-end-brackish well water (TDS ~1300 ppm, out of whish 500 ppm is Ca and Mg) and RO water. Current RO capacity is 2000 gal a day. Will add another RO system or membrane(s). May or may not add a softener station. I will collect and use rain water too off of the whole lanai and our 3300 sq ft and 2700 sq ft ranch houses.

Apart from all the costly permits, site modifications, etc., I have only ~$35,000 to invest into the exhibits at the start. Very, very measly by any/most measures. Cannot hire a reputable professional, like Aquatic Exhibit Group, so have to seek other options.

IRS mandates us that the business must be in operation by Mar 2012, that is providing goods/services and paying taxes, W2 salaries, etc. But I need the tanks even sooner – the fish I have currently is in need of larger homes already and I keep collecting large fish as opportunities arise.

Unless cost-prohibitive, the tanks/exhibits should rest on either legs or a base (cinder blocks, or solid concrete, or concrete walls with gravel or sand inside, etc.), which should be 2'-3' high to bring the tank bottom level closer to the eye level of the viewers. The base/legs will rest on the lanai floor (which may be only 4" thick – I do not know for sure yet; may be too thin a slab for a static load; ok for a point load). Also, the lanai floor has a pitch for the rain water run off and two steps in the middle making one quarter of the lanai raised by 1-1.5'. This is a big inconvenience for installing the tanks level, making the level base even more desirable.

The window dimensions should be maximized, thus minimizing or ideally leaving no blind spots for the viewers.

The bottom of each tank, ideally, should be tapered on the inside at about 5 degrees towards the bottom drain at one end of the tank - the bottom drain may be just a dimple with a hole, into which I will install a bulkhead,.

I've spent a lot of time over the last year reading everything that I could possibly find about big tanks or ponds with windows. The stickiest point is, of course, the window. I think I've more or less carefully considered and consulted, where I could, with professionals on the fish tanks made of fiberglass (mass produced and custom), acrylic, glass, concrete, stainless steel, aluminum, rubber liner, PE, plywood/wood, etc.

I aim at a ~700 gal tank to be my smallest exhibit, something like 8’x4’x3’ of water.

(1) Glass: very expensive, around $3500-$4000 for ~700 gal, and very heavy but still on the table. Really, only Glasscages.com build such tanks that are available and affordable. They have a sketchy history of quality – a lot of satisfied customers are out there but there are plenty dissatisfied. Try Google.
135 gal 72x18x25 $369 2.7 $/gal
240 gal 96x24x25 $759 3.2 $/gal
300 wide 96x30x25 $1201 4.0 $/gal
340 gal 130x25x24 $1455 4.3 $/gal
375-8 wide 96x36x25 $1819 4.9 $/gal
500-8wide 96x48x25 $2669 5.3 $/gal
610-C2.5 130x37x30 $2940 4.8 $/gal

(2) Acrylic: even more expensive, $4000-$5000, up to $6000 for ~700 gal. See the on-line price lists of companies like Fintastic (GA; http://www.fintastic.us/Tenecor_JUN2011_MSRP.pdf ), Livingcolor (FL), and Tyde Pool (CA). Acrylic vs. Glass: very long but informative discussion http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forum ... S.-ACRYLIC (I’d pay attention to only first 10 or so pages, after that the quality degrades a lot and also people start repeating the same things).

From the Tenecore price list: these are the kinds I'd be interested in. I may choose them as they are or choose bigger (e.g., imagine joining these together and making 2-3 very long tanks but still at 4' (preferably 6') wide and 2', 2.5', or 3' deep; may be straight or L-shaped). These are outside dimensions:

Ultra-Rectangles U525 120x48x24 4,525$
Ultra-Rectangles U670 120x48x30 5,032$ (appears the best match for the combo of my needs and price)
Ultra-Rectangles U775L 120x48x36 7,126$
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Why is this one, only 2' shorter, so much less expensive??
Ultra-Rectangles U620 96x48x36 4,503$ (vs 7,126$)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
This price difference may be more understandable??
Ultra-Rectangles U535 96x48x30 3,719$ (vs 5,032$)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Greg Sowers (Fintastic owner) wrote to me:
Tenecor lead time will be 8 weeks but 3 guys just left Tenecor recently and started their own company. Their tank builder worked as Tenecor’s Lead Senior Tank builder for 12 years and went with them, so I feel pretty comfortable that the tank quality will be the same. They are telling me their lead time right now is 4 weeks. They will also be competitive to Tenecor. Tenecor is from Arizona and the new company I am actually not sure. I will find out but it will not change shipping more than 2 days. You should plan on a week for shipping to be safe anyhow.

From another vendor (that works with Fintastic) that is a little higher end and are full acrylic units (freight and crate are extra):
96x36x36.. 3/4" acrylic.. $4,375 ea.
96x48x36.. 3/4" acrylic.. $4,625 ea.
120x36x30.. 3/4" acrylic.. $4,875 ea.
120x60x36..1” acrylic.. $12,000 ea. 1,122 gallons.

(2a) Polycarbonate can be mentioned here but I know of no polycarbonate tanks. Only windows. From what I was told by Jack Broyl (owner-operator of Dolphin Fiberglass Products), these windows are approx. functionally the same as acrylic. Although others on the i-net claim they are even more scratchable than acrylic; still others say they are not.

(3) Stainless steel+window: cannot find a precedent of a large tank described on the net and having a window. Projected to be as expensive as acrylic or even more – problem is not only the high price of the SS but also the length of time and the high labor intensity of the very slow welding process of SS. Unlikely – too expensive.

(4) Concrete+window: this is a popular choice and, of course, a permanent and immobile construction. Examples: 2500 gal, 2 windows http://www.anythingfish.com/Todds%20ray ... shTank.htm
5000 gal, 2 windows http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forum ... by-JohnPTC
2600 gal, our own ElTofi http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =5&t=32680

So, this has been done and more or less well described but only (in my search) by DIY-ers in US as well as by several UK companies (google “koi ponds with windows” – some of them are out of business already but all of them, strangely, are in UK). Waterproofed by epoxy, fiberglass, pool-type waterproof concrete, and other coatings, which I do not know what they contain, e.g., used by ElTofi. This option may come out to be less expensive, especially if I do it myself, perhaps, $1000-$1500 in materials and zero for my labor (~700 gal tank).

John Polk and I have had a long conversation (owner-operator of Tydepoolmarine, CA): John professes that all concrete tanks leak. Even the best built Public Aquaria tanks will start leaking after a year or so. No matter how well waterproofed, concrete cannot hold water, fresh or salt. Even the shallow ones, just like my targeted tanks of the 2'-3' depth. The only leak-proof, big tank options are full acrylic or FRP (fiber reinforced plastic) with acrylic/glass windows.

(5) Precast concrete+window: here are some quotes from OldCastle Precast: “…. The 8'x4'x3'bottom and walls only would be $1000. The stainless steel frame, epoxy coating, bottom drain would be something we could fabricate in the structure but will require more time to get those prices. … 10'x5'x3' (1100 US gal) would be priced at $1844…. the 20'x10'x3' (6000 US gal) would be $5703 and would weigh ~22 tons.”

(6) Plywood+window: been done, examples: 1700 gal one window http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/d ... tank_1.php
2400 gal one window and 8000 gal 2 windows : Ted built plywood tropical tanks in his backyard in Seattle http://www.anythingfish.com/images/Ted/ ... rIndex.htm
600 gal, one window, exceptionally well described http://www.jonolavsakvarium.com/eng_diy ... itres.html

(7) Rubber liner+window: I’ve seen the pics of such pond-aquarium hybrids on the net but never came across how the liner+window seam is made waterproof. I can imagine a few options. But out of all ponds, I have the most experience with building rubber liner ponds (no windows) and I do not want to deal with them anymore. They are unsightly. Big fish puncture them and some chew them. The liner would have to be under a protective layer of something, e.g. concrete or acrylic, etc. I do not like it. But it is so economical relative to other options!

(8) Polyethylene or polypropelene, etc (PE): cheap big tubs are available, e.g., $800 for 1000 US gal water storage tanks. Never found anyone putting a window in one of those. Strongest, least buckle-prone, and cheapest are the cylindrical tubs, which means the window will have to be curved. That’s a con. Would need a strong frame for the window. Even so, this material just bows too much – the window will never last leak-free, more than likely.

(9) Aluminum: as discussed here and other i-net places, can be toxic to fish, not good. http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =+aluminum

(10) Finally, Fiberglass tubs+window: these are the front runners at the moment.

Aquaticeco.com, near Orlando FL - only two sizes suitable for me, 8’x4’x3’, $2000, 8’x4’x2.5’ $1600
http://www.aquaticeco.com/subcategories ... 1063569469
These are mass-produced I think in Malaysia or Indonesia. Problem with these: the aquatic-eco fiberglass tubs with windows do not look like that pictured on their website. The one pictured is probably a small(er) tank.

The 600 US gal, 8'x4'x30", $1630 tank (product # FT523W2) has a 69"x17" window.
The 720 US gal, 8'x4'x3', $2005 tank (product # FT632W2) has a 63"x15.5" window (yes, even smaller).

The website pic is, therefore, quite misleading. Bummer. The aquatic-eco tanks are out of consideration.

Their acrylic windows are pretty thin too at only 1/4". What's wrong with this thickness? Greg Sowers wrote: These tanks are for fish farming and not public aquarium viewing. The acrylic will bow and is not very good quality as these things are not designed for what you are wishing to use them for. They will not leak, but will not be a good long or short term option in my opinion.

Ok. I guess, I'd be open to getting roughly the same gallonage for the same price. That is,

-- if I bought 5 to 10 of the 600 gal $1630 tanks, I'd get 3000 to 6000 gal of tank space for $8150 to $16,300. That's 2.7 $ per gal.
-- if I bought 5 to 10 of the 720 gal $2005 tanks, I'd get 3600 to 7200 gal of tank space for $10,000 to $20,000. That's 2.8 $/gal.

Current front runner: Dolphin Fiberglass Products, Homestead, FL - - http://www.aquaculturetanks.com/
Nice Company and nice owner, Jack Broyl. Spent a few hours with him. They cannot beat the above aquatic-eco $2005 price for an 8’x4’x3’, the closest would be $2500-$2750 (but with a nice big window). They can make any size tanks and have the molds for many bigger tanks - see their nice on-line collections of photos and the price list – almost all the tanks of my interest – square, semi-square, and rectangular can have windows installed.

Please, take a look a their, for example, semi-square fiberglass tanks - $14,000 (well, maybe $14,500 or $15,000 today) buys 25'x25'x6' = 23,000 gal. Throw in acrylic window(s) and it will be close to $20,000-22,000 or so. Result with windows: ~1 dollar per gallon.

This is just an example - I'd only be able to get these huge tanks when/if my business takes off. At the moment, I am more interested in their newest product (not listed in their catalog or their price list yet) – semi-square tank 13'x13'x4' = 5000 gal for only ~$7000. Add window(s) - maybe $10,000-$12,000. Result: ~2 dollars per gallon.

I spoke with Jack Broyl, owner of Dolphin Fiberglass Products again last week. Asked about warranty again and the history of their aquariums. Jack says even though they guarantee their aquariums against leaks for only 2 years (with proper install), he has never had a single leak complain on or after warranty in 15 years that he has been making aquariums. I am meeting with him tomorrow again.

I have been also considering Dolphin's rectangular tanks, price list page 6 and 7. Something like 20'x7'x3' = 3000 gal, ~$6000, add windows, perhaps $10,000. That's still 3.3 dollars per gallon. Better than 7.5 $/gal for the U670 Tenecor tanks cited above.

Greg Sowers: I just received the information from another supplier. This will not meet with your deadline, but it is an aquarium that I think would meet your needs. 1,430 gallon rectangular fiberglass tank – 36” tall x 48” wide x 192” long, flat bottom, open top with top lip, fabricated from a premium grade, isophthalic resin with a smooth pool blue gel coated interior and a textured gray pigmented exterior. Complete with two (2) 30” tall x 81” long (viewing area) windows and one (1) 2” drain fitting $23,000 FOB Texas – lead time 18 to 24 weeks ADA (after drawing approval).

This is too expensive, 16 dollars per gallon, even compared to the fully acrylic Ultra-Rectangles U670 120x48x30 5,032$ (7.5 $/gal). For $23,000 I can have 4.6 (say 5) of such tanks totaling 3082 gal. This is far better than 1430 gal for 23,000.

Shawn J. Rich (Director of Sales, Living Color): We have come up with the Fiberglass/Acrylic tank proposal as requested. The dimensions we discussed on the phone were: 180" Long x 96" Wide x 30" High. The acrylic view window would only be on one side (the 180x30 window). The acrylic viewing panel will be 1.25" thick, seamless and fully transparent. The cost of the design and fabrication of the tank only = $27,600. Shipping, installation, filtration, lighting and sales taxes are excluded.

2200 gal for 27,600 - 12.5 $/gal. Also more expensive vs. U670's. The reason we are considering the fewer-but-larger-tanks scenario is to save money in dollar per gallon. This is the same reason to go with FRP+windows vs. full acrylic.

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As of today, I am hoping for two Dolphin Fiberglass tanks, 13’x13’x3’, 3750 gal with two 8’x3’ acrylic windows each – that’s ~$20,000-$25,000 and ~$10,000-$15,000 worth of glass tanks, say seven 135 gal $369 and seven 240 gal $759, from Glasscages (I dot think I will be able to keep buffing out the scratches from acrylic display tanks).
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I hope reading this was not a waste for you.

Viktor

[MatsP]

Viktor, nice to see that you are making some progress on your project.

One point is making me wonder:

I intend to employ no heating or cooling of the water and no bio-filtering – it's a flow-through system: one pipe in and one pipe out and perhaps a few bubblers to keep the tanks well aerated and stirred.

I know you have access to large quantities of water, so maybe it's not a problem, but I would've thought that some biological filtration is required, as the ammonia (and probably nitrite) would be released by the fish in the tanks, and unless you replace literally all water in less than 24 hours, it could reach leveles where the fish are affected. But I have never tried to run a large aquarium without bio filtration, so I can't say for sure.

--
Mats

[Viktor Jarikov]

Yeah, Mats, I'd like to bypass bio-filtering (namely over and above what occurs naturally) but don't know if I will be able to, especially at higher stocking levels. But I'd much rather increase the flow - this will keep the water temp (and maybe oxygen) in check too - than set up bio-filtering. Summer highs average 95 F in June-July-Aug. Winter lows average 55 F in 1/2 Dec-Jan-1/2Feb. Although I will have a greenhouse-kind of an effect, incoming water at 74 F may be my saving grace.

This is how koi-farms are set up around here in large, open concrete ponds and their stocking density is high. Anyway, time will show. I won't be able to start with a heavy bio load.

On the same topic, I hope to be able to get tubs with relief walls to increase the surface area dramatically, e.g. 10-100 times.

[crkinney]

Hey Viktor , That old ship looks better all the time.
mule

[Bas Pels]

Yeah, Mats, I'd like to bypass bio-filtering (namely over and above what occurs naturally) but don't know if I will be able to, especially at higher stocking levels.

actually, I think - assuming unlimited watersupply - this will be the cheapest way by far

Any filtration costs money - energycosts and it needs space, thus bigger or more buildings.

For a tank, we normally speak about a 3 times an hour turnover of the water through the filter. This water is supposed to come out of the filter without any ammonia or nitrite, but eventually loaded with nitrate.

No filtration, but a flow through system could provide water free of ammonia or nitrite but also poor in nitrate - as the natural water is most often low in nitrate. This water would, I think, not even flow through with a speed of 3 times an hour or more, assuming the tank has a few current producing pumps

But even in case one would replace the water 3 times an hour, the energy cost could be similar to the original situaltion (each tank its own filter) without the need for a place for the filter

Put differently, in such a case the lake is used as a biofilter. BUT in my country such use of a lake would require permits (and, as the water is too cold here, the whole idea would not work)

[Viktor Jarikov]

Thanks, Bas. I am hoping for a 50% of the volume daily-turn-over in the 2000-5000 gal tanks and 100-200% in the small 135 and 240 gal tanks to start with and then monitor and adjust as I go on and keep adding inhabitants.

Koi farmers do not have to care about treating well-water much. At most, just soften it a little bit or use as is (low end brackish). I have to RO my water and then mix raw and RO water in about 30%-70% or 50%-50% ratio and then also put (all of it or just raw) through carbon filter because the raw water is greenish, I presume from tannins. Moreover, my raw water has 0.25 ppm ammonia - so I have to put it through a bio filter; lacks oxygen completely, so I need to aerate it; and smells of sulfides a little/a lot (depending on your sensitivities), so has to be treated with an oxidizer, like a peroxide to kill the smell but aeration usually does it too (ozone, I suppose; but not on my flow rate - I'd have to deplete all ozone above Naples FL ).

Yeah, I know of ozonators and used to own one 60 W. Ozone may also kill tannins and ammonia to clean up and clear up the water too. So can hydrogen peroxide, which is pretty cheap. Decomposing peroxide will also oxygenate it

Still, I agree with you that bio-filtering is still less desirable, from both energy consumption point of view and labor and space.

I am dumping the used water in my several million gal lake and am told by the County and others that all they care about is that the water returns to the ground and no drainage is changed. Will see.

[Viktor Jarikov]

Hey Viktor , That old ship looks better all the time.

Kinky touches with unknown outcomes can be added later on but gotta start with the basics

[crkinney]

kinky me?
mule

[Suckermouth]

Hey Viktor, I have just visited the Tennessee Aquarium in Chattanooga. They have a ton of huge fish, and species that get huge, from various parts of the world (Arapaima, Pacu, Blue Catfish, Channel Catfish, Flathead Catfish, Koi, Sturgeon, Paddlefish, Gar), so I'd consider either visiting, contacting them, or both.

[Viktor Jarikov]

Thanks Milton. I looked at their webpage - nice place.

Small update, Dec 15, 2011: a month ago or so, I ordered

(1) two 13'x'13'x4.5' (outside dimensions; inside ~4500 gal) semi-square tanks from Dolphin Fiberglass Products. One 8'x4'x2.5" acrylic window (7.5'x3.5' visible area) per tank. $15,000 each tank. Acrylic window is ~50% of the price tag (ouch) - as much as the tank itself and the labor to put it all together. Comes in 4 pieces that I will have to put together; and

(2) ten 240 gal glass tanks from GlassCages.com, 96"x24"x25", $759. Their delivery would be ~$1500.

Sometimes I think/feel I am way in over my head... and then I remember I am.

[MatsP]

So when are these tnaks being delivered, do you know yet?

--
Mats

[Viktor Jarikov]

Glasscages in Jan. Dolphin FG - Feb. Both manufacturers are quite popular and very busy these days.

[TheFishGuy]

Subscribed! How much will admission be?

[Viktor Jarikov]

Well, tell me if it is worth a try or plain silly but I've been mulling over "pay what YOU think is a fair admission price". People would come, look, and pay at exit.

Since it is such a small start-up, I am thinking of sampling customer expectations that way and it may also help avoid people being too disappointed (who, e.g., took a drive to get here; although I am pro honesty in advertising and will advertise the venture for what it is - a tiny start-up... because people hear Public Aquarium and think of those huge multi-million-billion $$$ facilities and here I am with a 5-figure budget...).

If I am underpaid, by my standards, then we may have to switch to a standard cover charge of... oh, maybe $3 for the first several months. As we add more tanks and fish, the price will rise...

But that's all wishful thinking atm... I have not secured my main permit yet - rezoning. NIM (neighborhood information meeting Jan 23; three meetings with the County Board of Commissioners and the County Planning Committee to follow...).

GlassCages tanks are arriving this Sat, Jan 21. I am finishing the stands for these 10 just barely in time. Hopefully.

[Suckermouth]

Well, tell me if it is worth a try or plain silly but I've been mulling over "pay what YOU think is a fair admission price". People would come, look, and pay at exit.

Since it is such a small start-up, I am thinking of sampling customer expectations that way and it may also help avoid people being too disappointed (who, e.g., took a drive to get here; although I am pro honesty in advertising and will advertise the venture for what it is - a tiny start-up... because people hear Public Aquarium and think of those huge multi-million-billion $$$ facilities and here I am with a 5-figure budget...).

If I am underpaid, by my standards, then we may have to switch to a standard cover charge of... oh, maybe $3 for the first several months. As we add more tanks and fish, the price will rise...

I'm not convinced that this strategy will do anything besides doom you to failure. Pick an admission price that will cover your costs. If you have an idea of what being underpaid is, do not allow your customers to set a price that underpays you. As a sidenote, being "too cheap" can also give a negative appearance to your business.

[Viktor Jarikov]

Thanks, Milton. You know, one would think so but I've also read an interesting article about a guy who runs a restaurant like that here in the US. It is not the cheapest nor very expensive food, about $40 a person a dinner. He claims most people pay the fair price. Some pay less but they are balanced out by some that actually pay more.

I think, if anything, it is an interesting experiment.

I plan not to indicate any prices in my leaflets/ads/flyers but simply state to call such and such # for prices, hours, and directions, which will be given in the automated greeting message.

I am not set on hours either yet. For starters (read weeks-to-months), I'd like to be open every day 9 am to 6 pm and then decide which hours/days to carve out.

I am my own boss. If things go wrong, they can be adjusted on the dime. But I am making note of your opinion - it surely counts - and hope more people will chime in.

Truth of the matter, I see these as very minor things and can go either way on this one, easily.

[Viktor Jarikov]

As a sidenote, being "too cheap" can also give a negative appearance to your business.

Care to elaborate?

[Viktor Jarikov]

Ok, some initial photos...

Inside the 55'x55' lanai where the main exhibit area will be. Wooden stands for the ten 240-gal GlassCages tanks.

[Viktor Jarikov]

...

[MatsP]

Looks good so far!

When's the "glass" coming?

--
Mats

[Viktor Jarikov]

I needed a rain-free, shaded, better-climate-controlled space instead of the screened-in lanai/courtyard. The estimates for a hard roof (e.g., metal) or a vinyl awning were coming in at $30,000-$40,000. So, I am modifying the screen cage myself to enable putting over a tarp/plastic in a green-house manner (except 90% or more of light will be blocked, at least during summers)...

[Viktor Jarikov]

...

[Viktor Jarikov]

Temporary housing "pond duplex" for some of the fish...

[Viktor Jarikov]

Main entrance in the works...

[Viktor Jarikov]

Here are the ten 240 gal tanks. Took 4 guys plus my wife and my mother-in-law (yeah, )to place them... Was told by GlassCages they are 650 lbs each but I think, really, probably 400-450 lbs each. 1/2" glass all around. 8'x2'x2'. $759 each. $1450 to ship all 10 from Tennessee.

[Viktor Jarikov]

...

[Viktor Jarikov]

A look around the 9-acre property, if interested. (Lazy man's version)

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/316-M ... 7557_zpid/

[sidguppy]

wow

it must be fun to have millions and millions of dollars......your kitchen is bigger than my house!

9 acres!
geez, over here they use that amount of land to put in a whole village

wow

it all looks great, though. very nice

not afraid all the 240 gallon tanks are going to overheat under the glass dome?

florida's a hot place afaik and it'll work like a greenhouse.

why not use "indoor ponds"?
I know of several tropical fishbreeders who are in Florida, one is Laif Demason.
he breeds Madagascar cichlids (along with Riftlake cichlids) and those are particular heat-loving fish, but in florida those breed in ponds (maybe just in summer, no idea).

[Viktor Jarikov]

SG: it must be fun to have millions and millions of dollars......
VJ: you are "only" off by three orders of magnitude, is all.

SG: 9 acres! geez, over here they use that amount of land to put in a whole village
VJ: Just to make sure we are on the same page - one acre comprises 4,840 square yards, 43,560 square feet or 4,047 square metres (0.405 hectares) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acre

SG: not afraid all the 240 gallon tanks are going to overheat under the glass dome?
VJ: yes I am but there is no glass dome planned but a largely opaque canopy.

SG: florida's a hot place afaik and it'll work like a greenhouse.
VJ: greenhouse effect relies on light entering inside it. There will be almost none in warmer months. The two 55'x20' sides of this canopied structure will be open (apart from the mosquito net) for a breeze to cool the place, fish, and visitors a bit. The water pumped into the tanks will always be close to 74 F - ground temp; year round. No water return.

SG: why not use "indoor ponds"?
VJ: I view it as a indoor-outdoor hybrid. It's all I can afford atm with my insufficiently deep pockets.

SG: I know of several tropical fishbreeders who are in Florida, one is Laif Demason.
he breeds Madagascar cichlids (along with Riftlake cichlids) and those are particular heat-loving fish, but in florida those breed in ponds (maybe just in summer, no idea).
VJ: deep ponds are kept cooler by the earth. Shallow can easily hit upper 80 F and low 90 F.

[MatsP]

So, essentially, the plot of land you are on is 36000 sq.meter. My flat is 42sq.meter (450sqft), so it would fit, roughly, 900 times on that piece of land... ;)

--
Mats