PlanetCatfish.com

Hello Everyone

I have found somebody that can get and I really like them. I have a tank measuring 36 long by 12 wide and 16 tall (inches), How many do think I could keep in the tank? I was thinking a group of 5 but the only basis I have for stocking levels is the COTM article. The scape planned is pretty much just a lot of rock to form caves and densely planted with sturdy plants (Amazon swords and friends). The substrate will be fine sand and not deep to prevent a anaerobic layer forming ( I was thinking maybe 1/2 an inch deep).


Any tips would be appreciated!

Ok so I know filtration is extremely important for these guys so Im thinking an external canister rated for 303 GPH (so that should re circulate the entire tank approximately 10 times per hour) would this be adequate? I plan on feeding rather sparingly just because most videos of this fish I have seen the fish look rather obese. As far as the aquascape goes I plan on a few large rocks and some smaller ones with a piece of drift wood tangle securely around the stones. This will be heavily planted with different Echinodorus plants and take up in total about 1/3 of the tank. The rest of the tank will have an open foot print and be sporadically planted to give the fish ample swimming room at night. Icing on the cake will be a lighting system released fall of 2015 that I can control the brightness of and as an added bonus would have blue "moonlights" hopefully allowing me to observe there nocturnal activities. (I would just be using the light the tank comes with until the knew model is released).

I do have some concerns though... If I use a planted tank soil for where I plan to plant heavily will these cats just dig it all up? To cycle the tank I plan on gradually adding tetras from my well established 55, would this be a bad Idea as I know that that wild fish are more vulnerable to tank strain viruses however none of the fish In my 55 have shown signs of disease (in fact there happy enough to spawn). The only illness the 55 has run into was a group of Corydoras loxonus whom all had cloudy eyes and despite my treatments all perished but one, who was relocated. Would it be safe to take one of my filters sponges and introduce to the other tank (same filter)?

Thanks for all the views everyone, but replies are what I need here ;)

Filtration isn't that important for these guys, average will do. Five would certainly be ok in a 36" tank.

Jools

You cannot grow amazon swords in 1/2 inch of substrate. In fact there are not a lot of plants at all you can grow in that little depth. When one has roots in their substrate, anaerobic pockets are actually created naturally because of the ecosystem down under. I have had an Amazon sword outgrow a 75 gal. tank. And then there is this

Limnol. Oceanogr.. 42(3), 1997, 529-537
0 1997, by the American Society of Limnology and Oceanography, Inc.

Nitrification and denitrification in the rhizosphere of the aquatic macrophyte Lobelia dortmanna L.

Nils Risgaard-Petersen’ and Kim Jensen
Institute of Biological Science, Department of Microbial Ecology, University of Aarhus, Ny Munkegade Bldg. 540,
DK-8000 Aarhus C, Denmark

Abstract

Nitrogen and 0, transformations were studied in sediments covered by Lobelia dortmanna L.; a combination of
lsN isotope pairing and microsensor (0,, NO,-, and NH,+) techniques were used. Transformation rates and microprofiles
were compared with data obtained in bare sediments. The two types of sediment were incubated in doublecompartment
chambers connected to a continuous flow-through system.

The presence of L. dortmanna profoundly influenced both the nitrification-denitrification activity and porewater
profiles of 02, NO,-, and NH,+ within the sediment. The rate of coupled nitrification-denitrification was greater
than sixfold higher in L. dortmanna-vegetated sediment than in bare sediment throughout the light-dark cycle.
Illumination of the Lobelia sediment reduced denitrification activity by -30%. In contrast, this process was unaffected
by light-dark shifts in the bare sediment. Oxygen microprofiles showed that 0, was released from the L.
dortmanna roots to the surrounding sediment both during illumination and in darkness. This release of 0, expanded
the oxic sediment volume and stimulated nitrification, shown by the high concentrations of NO,- (-30 FM) that
accumulated within the rhizosphere. Both lsN, isotope and microsensor data showed that the root-associated nitrification
site was surrounded by two sites of denitrification above and below, and this led to a more efficient coupling
between nitrification and denitrification in the Lobelia sediment than in the bare sediment.

(Blue color has been added by me.)
from http://m.m.aslo.info/lo/toc/vol_42/issue_3/0529.pdf (Blue color has been added by me.)

I agree. If you want to grow live plants you should plan on having a minimum of 2" of substrate.

An alternative is to plant the plants in clay pots. Then you could have a thin substrate over the rest of the tank and the plants have enough substrate to root in.

It doesn't look as natural but everything gets what they want.

Andy

Thanks every one!

Thanks for the tip jools, I think I'll just go with the 206 filter then (still External canister), Also relieved to know I'm not over stocking!

Narwhal, twotank thanks for the tips! I plan on making a nice bank of soil on one side, anywhere I plan on putting plants the substrate will be at least 3 inches. Overall happy fish comes first, I'll cope with the asethetics (I think it will look nice in the end).

any tips for a feeding schedule?

You'll probably find they will re-aquascape your soil bank and create a big mess. Pots are the way to go.

racoll wrote:You'll probably find they will re-aquascape your soil bank and create a big mess. Pots are the way to go.

I feared they would remake it for me, even if the soil bank is under 1-2 inches of sand? I plan on securing the plants with rocks (which means the soil would also be under rocks) would this make a difference?

I find that many plants do well in shallow sand, 1/2" thick, including Crypt. wendtii, Val. americana, Sagitaria subulata, and many different types of stem plants, favorites of mine being Limnophila aquaticum (Ambulia) and Hygrophila angustifolia. For rooted plants, I recommend potting them until the tank has been established a couple of months, in order to build up some mulm in the substrate, which will feed the plants. I'll then transfer plants to the shallow sand. Crypts in particular will thrive once established, and will spread roots out that will cover a large surface area, and they will do better than potted and fertilized crypts in the same low tech tanks. Send me a PM, and I'll happily share pics or elaborate more on species that I find do well.

Eric

That's very interesting Eric. I have not found crypts in particular to grow well in 1/2" of anything. I can see Val's and Sagittaria doing well as they have fairly shallow roots. But a crypt with a long and deep penetrating rhisome generally does best for me at about 2".

And admittedly the crypts in my Biocube aren't looking so hot right now (I need to change bulbs). But I generally have really lush growth. You should have seen them in the Illuminata when I had it setup.

Andy

Can anybody recommend a feeding shcedule for these fish? All the specimens I see in youtube videos look obese, I would like to prevent this.

So if put the soil bank under 1.5-2 inches of sand and only put the soil where I plan on planting the tank (along the back and mid area and a few plants in an open foraging area) I don't plan on having plants in and around the cave Im making for them.

so for feeding I will probably be giving them carnivore sinking pellets or blood worms, krill and brine shrimp every three days and feed a little sparingly. Does that sound like a good approach?

I feel like I'm giving this thread defibrillators...

I plan on planting the tank with Pogostemon helferi as a carpet plant of sorts, do you guys think they will dislodge these? I should add that I plan on letting everything root over the course of a month, would they still just wreck the entire scape? I also plan on adding substrate supports, hopefully this is enough to keep that soil bank in one place. And don't worry about half the tank is totally open so at night they can swim around in a frenzy over some nice sand.

do you guys think they will dislodge these? I should add that I plan on letting everything root over the course of a month, would they still just wreck the entire scape? I also plan on adding substrate supports, hopefully this is enough to keep that soil bank in one place.

I don't think soil banks, foraging doradids, and gravity are a good combination. I could be wrong, so by all means give it a try. Sometimes it's just best to learn things from experience.

My fishkeeping improved 1000% after I learnt to stop overthinking things. I used to buy every gadget and potion imaginable, and plan all my tanks to the Nth degree. They all failed miserably, of course. These days I just buy whatever fishes are available in my area and keep them in simple tanks that are easy to maintain. I only keep fishes that will do well in my tapwater, and I don't keep more than two species per tank either. Both of these things help a lot!

Well now im just anxious, ive been planning this tank like a heist! I have a simple tank with 5 species but i fin my self wanting a nice aqaua scape that will make both myself and the fish happy. In videos I have of seen of this species they seem to be fron very densely planted areas and mucky bottoms so I always have that going for me.

I'll keep you guys updated, I got the tank last night so theres no going back now!