First spawn of L397

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nabulus
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First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

A week ago I noticed a male L397 sat on a pile of eggs fanning. It's a small clutch but size of eggs is huge. I find interesting that after 7 days, the eggs are still not hatched. I can clearly see the embryos so they are not infertile eggs. Whether it is normal or not for them to take so long to hatch, I don't know. The water temperature is 28-28.5C.

L397 is a really tough species and good for beginners like me. I have kinda ignored them for a while due to busy work and frequent traveling but they are thriving in my tank. They eat everything I give to them. I used to worry that I have given them too much meaty food but I (or my wife while I am away) feed them black worms four-five days a week and they are fine. Half of the tank is filled will various kinds of drift woods tho so I guess that could help them digest.

Thanks for @bekateen for this beautiful species and a lot of great advice. I learned a lot by raising them.

-Ke

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by Baardman »

congrats!!!

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by bekateen »

Hi Ke,

This is terrific success. Good for you, my friend. I hope the fry hatch safely, and I can assure you the floodgates will open as you start getting spawn after spawn.

Cheers!
Eric
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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by Linus_Cello »

What is your TDS? I think I read somewhere on this forum that hard water makes the eggshells hard so fry have trouble hatching.

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

Linus_Cello wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:56 pm
What is your TDS? I think I read somewhere on this forum that hard water makes the eggshells hard so fry have trouble hatching.
Oh thank you for the suggestion! I actually have never monitored. :))
Also they have just hatched which is on day 9.

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

bekateen wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 4:44 am
Hi Ke,

This is terrific success. Good for you, my friend. I hope the fry hatch safely, and I can assure you the floodgates will open as you start getting spawn after spawn.

Cheers!
Eric
Thank you Eric!

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

Well I have had four spawns already since late Jan, from at least two pairs. The spawn have been easy but i found that the fry are not very easy to take care. The main issue that i have had was bloating. About 40-50% of the fry of every spawn got big stomachs/bloated before they start to eat. Among these fry some have not completely absorbed the yolk sac (belly was partly yellow). I have plenty of drift woods, Indian almond leaves and mulm from parents with the fry. I have tried leaving the fry in the same tank where they were born or a new tank, the mortality rate were consistent.
I googled around and found some hobbyists have had similar issues with L397 fry. Someone suggest the soft water could be the cause. I am not certain, but the ph was between 6-7.

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by bekateen »

Hi Ke,

Glad you've gotten so many spawns. Have any fry survived and are still growing?

The pH should be fine. Mine varies between 6 and 7.6.

What is your water hardness? Or can you measure tds?

What are you feeding them?

Cheers, Eric
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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

Hi Eric,
Yes those survived ones are eating well and growing. I have given them the food that you suggest, such as sera flora veggie flakes, cobalt spirulina flakes, sweet potatoes plus drift wood/leaves/mulm. The fry that survived love the flakes. But the fry that died have not started eating yet. Some still had yolk sac and got bloated stomachs. Some were just bloated with see through stomach.
I don't have hardness measures. But I can measure TDS. I think that it was around 130 last time i measured it.

Thanks!
-Ke
bekateen wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:35 pm
Hi Ke,

Glad you've gotten so many spawns. Have any fry survived and are still growing?

The pH should be fine. Mine varies between 6 and 7.6.

What is your water hardness? Or can you measure tds?

What are you feeding them?

Cheers, Eric

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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by bekateen »

My TDS is 250-400, sometimes higher. I'm not sure that's a factor, but maybe?

Good luck. I'm really glad you're getting some fry to survive.

Cheers, Eric
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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by TwoTankAmin »

A couple of quick observations. This is what this site says re 397:
Other Parameters- L397 is relatively tolerant of water hardness. Breeding has been reported in water with conductivity/TDS values ranging from around 200 to 700 uS/cm (125-450 ppm TDS).
Next, my experience, limited as it may be, has shown a number of the Amazon basin fish fish are more tolerant of the absolute numbers than is often thought. What is usually important is when one needs to do a dry rainy season to stimulate species to spawn. At this point the amount of change is important. If one starts at 250 ppm TDS you might shoot to drop that 125 -150 ppm. But, if you have tap water at 150 ppm, then you are looking at more like a 75 - 90 ppm drop. Of course this is not a universal guideline as there are always a few fish in a region that are more sensitively attuned to specific parameters and require more stringent guidelines.
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Re: First spawn of L397

Post by nabulus »

Thank you! I appreciate the info!!
TwoTankAmin wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:03 pm
A couple of quick observations. This is what this site says re 397:
Other Parameters- L397 is relatively tolerant of water hardness. Breeding has been reported in water with conductivity/TDS values ranging from around 200 to 700 uS/cm (125-450 ppm TDS).
Next, my experience, limited as it may be, has shown a number of the Amazon basin fish fish are more tolerant of the absolute numbers than is often thought. What is usually important is when one needs to do a dry rainy season to stimulate species to spawn. At this point the amount of change is important. If one starts at 250 ppm TDS you might shoot to drop that 125 -150 ppm. But, if you have tap water at 150 ppm, then you are looking at more like a 75 - 90 ppm drop. Of course this is not a universal guideline as there are always a few fish in a region that are more sensitively attuned to specific parameters and require more stringent guidelines.

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