Otocinclus Breeding

[James0816]

After quite a bit of searching and finding a decent price...I am finally, finally acquiring some O. Cocama. I just ordered (5) of the little guys. Shipping is the kicker but had to do it as couldn't find any one anywhere close to get them. Should be here on Friday. Going through the final prep of their future tank.

I did a last minute audible and chose the 10g with the Flourite substrate over the SMS. It's been aging a lot longer. And since the guys in the holding tank are breeding with the sand substrate, I don't think this will be much an issue. However, if I locate my O. Flexilis, then I will do the tank switcharoo.

[Mike_Noren]

I am finally, finally acquiring some O. Cocama.
--- if I locate my O. Flexilis, then I will do the tank switcharoo.

It will be very interesting to hear how you do with those.

The small species like vittatus and macrospilus occasionally spawn in captivity, but to the best of my knowledge O. flexilis has been bred only once, and O. cocama never. I don't think they're necessarily a lot harder to get to breed, I suspect there's fewer breeding reports because there are far fewer people keeping these larger species.

[James0816]

That's the goal of the project. Time has come to put it to test. Mind you I'm entering with very low expections due to the captivity portion. But, I do have some bit of confidence in seeing how rapidly the Vittatus are breeding. Gives me a glimmer and that's all need to get off the ground.

[James0816]

All looks well today:

Main Tank: Activity and fry visibility remains high. I will have to do a wc tomorrow. Just not liking the condition. The wee ones have discovered the zucchini and life is good...or at least they are acting like it is. ;o)

Holding Tank: Counted (13) wigglers on the glass today. No maintenance scheduled at this time.

New tank will be referred as the Cocama tank. Which as I just learned will not arrive tomorrow as planned. Vendor states that post office said delivery would be two days and not over night. They only included a single 24hr heat pack. So now it will be sometime next week. This will however, allow me to do a little more scaping. I have crypts thinned and sorted. Will be adding/rescaping more tomorrow. Will put up final specs of the tank once complete.

[James0816]

Getting ready to head out to the race. Quick morning check of things and all looks well.

Over in the main tank, the fry are growing very nicely and still remain extremely active. Keeping fingers crossed that this batch will yield quite a few.

Was able to find a few wigglers in the holding tank. Saw a couple of them already hitting the zucchini.

Making another different swing in the O. Cocama tank. This may not be permanent but will aid in the introduction of them to thier new home. I found a piece of Maylasian driftwood that I wasn't using. Bigger than I want but will comfortably fit in the 10g. I will also be adding a piece of slate. With these and the placement of the crypts, this will provide nice spots for them. There is no pattern for the flora so it will be mismatched at this time as well.

Will be adding them tomorrow and adjusting the flora. Will be all set and get my initial readings and other info posted.

[James0816]

Kind of a slow start today. Just now getting around to working on the tanks. Go downstairs and the first thing I wanted to check on were the fry in the holding tank. Seeing some of the adults swimming around, thinking nothing of it. Spot a couple fry. Things are doing pretty well. Then a female comes swimming up from behind the java fern and has (4) males tagging along. She stop on a dwarf sag and the males pounce! It was just amazing to watch this. The guys were all over her. A spawn was occuring right in front of me. Didn't have the camera at the moment and didn't want to make any sudden moves to distract them.

So there I sat in front of the tank for a good 20 minutes watching all this activity all over the place. Saw where she had laid a few eggs on a java fernlet (this one will be moved to the fry tank). Found more eggs on the sags. I then decided that I needed the camera. Got the camera and came back down and the spawn was still going on. They would do their thing and then take a small break and back at it. Was able to snap some shots and video. Going through them now to see how well they turned out.

Shot a couple videos over in the main tank as well. Stand by while I check them out.

[James0816]

Ok...first off...I'm not a peeping tom...I'm scientist. The video you are about to see is in the name of research. ;o)

Luckily it's not too good. This is best one of the spawn. I may upload another one but again, not a good as this one. You'll see the poor little gal literally being hounded by the four males.

[James0816]

Quick update while I fire up the grill.

Doing a 10% water change in the main tank at the moment. Still using the drip method to add the new water. Seem to be getting good results here lately doing it this way. Either that or I'm getting lucky. Fry count and activity remains high. I'm not sure how many eggs were laid while I was gone but I can say that at just over a week, there still remains quite a few in here. It's interesting as you can see the difference in the age groups from 1 to 4 weeks. Only frags of zuc remain. Preping new as well as the new food diet/routine that I do now. This will be the first feeding since returning. Tells you how much gunk was in there. Surprisingly though...the water parms remained consistant. Didn't fluctuate at all. Guess the plants enjoyed it.

Over in the holding tank, I was able to find a few more eggs laid after yesterday. Also counted (6) fry in this tank. Moved over (3) eggs to the hatching/fry tank.

Which now brings us to the fry tank. I'm not sure I will officially call this a test as the egg count is only (3). With such a low number, won't really have much to compare. With that said....pH is sitting nicely at 6.2. One minor adjustment I made to this tank was to add a very small amount of crushed coral. This is how I will regulate the pH. I've started out with a very thin layer at the bottom of a milk jug lid. I'll continue to test daily over the next week to see if I need to adjust it down any. The target of this tank is no more than 6.6.

Confirmed with vendor today that the O. Cocama will ship tomorrow for Thursday arrival.

[James0816]

One more video to get you through the night.

Here's one that shows the wee one snarfing a zucchini.

[James0816]

Quick update on the hatching today. Let's see if I can start simplifying this a bit.

Main: Added 1g of fresh water. Still visibly counted over (50) fry guys in here. Being very careful of what goes on in here as this is the highest brood to date. A piece of zucchini has floated to the top and I had to rescue (4) fry from the top. Otherwise, they would have been trapped as they were on the topside of it.

Holding: (need a better name for this tank) Maybe I'll hold a contest. ;o) Found a few of the new hatchlings and a few of the older fry. Will be going on a pond snail raid soon.

Fry Tank: Of the (3) eggs moved over, I found (2) wigglers today.

OC: Final preps to the tank will be completed tomorrow. Tried to get confirmation from the vendor that they actually shipped today. Haven't heard back as yet.

[James0816]

Kind of quiet the past few days. Nothing much going on. 10% water changes in the Vittatus and Cocama tanks. No new eggs, but mama Oto showing very nicely.

The Cocama's are still progressing and getting more comfortable with their home.

20% water change in the holding tank. Went on a pond snail raid as well. Thinned the herd quite a bit.

Still have (2) fry over in the fry tank. That's still promising considering that there were only (3) eggs moved over that latest round.

Renewing the CO2 bottles on all the tanks. (2) of them were completely spent. The others are still producing but won't last much longer as the jell-o is almost gone. Using the rice seems to have produced much better results.

Fresh zucchini added to all tanks.

[mangopleco]

good job.... what was the temp and ph of ur tank??? and how did u intoduce spawning because i just got 2 zebra otto's male and female i think.

[James0816]

I keep the temp right around 78 and pH at 7.4. I don't do anything to induce the spawn. I let it all happen naturally.

I just picked up a few Cocama's myself. Still ify on the ID but looks like (1) male to (3) females. I should have a positive ID within the week.

[James0816]

Water changes in all tanks today. Fresh zucchini added and a couple tanks I'm trying sweet potato in to see what they think.

Over in the main tank, I tried a new powdered based food. I'd have to say it got pretty good results wouldn't you:


The Cocama's are doing really well. Being very active and eating nicely.

Continuing with my snail raids as I go.

[James0816]

Came home today and found the Cocama tank cloudy. Interesting. Not sure if it was/is the sweet potato or not. The other tanks with the sweet potato though aren't cloudy. Hmmmm......I originally took it out but then I put it back in for now. I'm finding that it disentigrates easily. May not use it much after seeing this.

20% water change. Found the filter was pretty well clogged up too. Had to do a cleaning on it as well....brush out the tubes and squeeze out the sponge. I went ahead and started working on the scape a bit early.

Going to be pulling out alot of plants from some tanks. Just have way too many C. Wendtii and Pontederiifolia.

[James0816]

I started doing major rescaping. I'm starting with the holding tank. Pulled out several crypts, small sags and others. Still will be difficult to work with as I will be keeping the huge java fern in there. So I'll work around that. I kept one wendtii and (3) small pontederiifolia. Will be keeping 4-5 of the larger Dwarf Sags, few stems of Bacopa Monneri and L. Repens x. Arcuata. Might do some other things as I go...we'll see.

Over in the Cocama tank, it is clearing up. I doubt it was the SP that caused the cloudiness. I moved it over to another tank and it is fine. I believe it to be the remnants of the new food I was trying out. Now granted it was in the tank for quite a few days so it does make sense.

Fresh zucchini added to all tanks.

[James0816]

Been a spell since any updates. Well...not really a whole lot going on at the moment.

Just routine maintenance in all the tanks. Removed one C. Wendtii from the Vittatus tank. Might have to remove a couple more. Since last thinning of the jungle, it has just blown up. Half the tank is Crypts. The two females are just enormous.

I think mama oto is going to split if she doesn't unload soon. I'm thinking I have two variables going on here. The first is the amount of babies in the tank. Just a ton of em in here. Takes me back to last time when there was a large brood. After I moved a majority of them, she dropped over 100 eggs.

The second variable is regarding the outside environment. Now last year at this time, we were running the AC for my father. This kept the environment pretty fresh and cool. Right now, we still haven't turned it on. Room conditions are currently sitting at 74F and nearly 60% humidity. These are higher than normal. I'm going to start by using a couple of fans down there and see if I can get some circulation going and removing some of the humidity. We'll probably be turning the air on soon but in the mean time, I have to come up with something else.

The Cocama's continue to progress well. Pretty active. All look about the same size. Noone standing out just yet. I'm sure hoping that there is at least one male and one female. As it looks now, I might have four males. Youch. I'm contimplating looking to get a few more from another source to ensure I have a mix. We'll see. Still a couple months to go before a positive ID can be made.

That's it for now. Stay tuned.

[James0816]

Knew I was missing something. Blew away my IE and reinstalled. Lost my favs in the process. Good thing I was going through some notes last night. Forgot I had this journal out here as well. Anyway....

Taking a major swing at the Cocama tank to see if I can get this tank to turn around. The history with it is that it just doesn't produce like the others. Plant growth is very slow in comparison. This is using Flourite as a substrate, dry ferts and CO2. It is puzzling me greatly.

I'm starting out with a big vac. This will be a two day process so I don't stress my little guys out too much. They didn't seem to mind day one. Was able to remove quite a bit of gunk and the TDS dropped way down. Didn't think it was all that bad. Original level was just over 120. After first vac, it dropped 30 points.

Will be snail hunting during the reconstruction as well. The scaping will be switched up a bit as well. Moving some plants around and swapping out others.

If this doesn't coax the growth rate any, I will be pulling the substrate in favor of something else. I may just switch with the SMS that is in the O. Flexilis tank (which is currently waiting stocking).

As for the Vittatus, someone must have thrown some happy pills in both tanks. The activity the past couple of days has been really high. I think it's just that the tanks are getting back to where they should be again. Glad to see that.

I think I have decided to remove the big Java Fern and replace it with a small plant as well as add a plantlet of 'Trident'. It's just too big for the tank. So if anyone is looking for a huge JF, let me know.

More water changes and prunning on tap for the next two days. Still haven't moved the juvies over yet with all the work going on. I changed things in mid stride and didn't want to cause them any undue stress. They should be ready to move by the weekend. The holding tank is kind of bare. I have about 12 or so left. Will get a better feel once the fern comes out. Hope they are all doing fine in their new homes.

[James0816]

Well this is an update I've been waiting to post. I'm home today waiting on the insurance agent to arrive (weekend washing machine disaster).

Just went to check on the tanks and come up with a plan of attack to do water changes. I didn't get the chance to do them this weekend for being out and then cleanup.

All tanks doing really well. Haven't found any further casulties from my previous tank move. Still have at least (5) more juvies I need to move from the Vittatus breeder.

Checked the holding tank last as usual. Nice discovery. I found a fry on the front glass. Kewlness! Did a quick scan of the tank and found a few more here and there. And just when I was about ready to pull out that big Java Fern too!

I'll do a minor top off of that tank and do regular water changes on the others.

[James0816]

Removed the last of the juvies from the Vittatus breeder. It's strictly an adults only party now. ;) Holding tank is full once again. Weather permitting, will start looking for homes next week.

Part 2 of the tank rebuild is underway. The crypt jungle is once again being thinned. These things are growing like crazy! Pulled out (6) more plants. These ones are pretty big. Still leaving the mother crypt in there. Thinned the Subwassertang wall just a bit more. Major gravel under the jungle since they have been uprooted. Jugs were black from the goodies under there.

Shrimp are definately loving the stuff that was stirred up. Will get the crypts replanted and then work on the left side of the tank. This will take a few days to complete. Think I should have it back together by Tuesday.

[James0816]

Activity levels are on the rise again. That's great news. Did water changes in all the breeders. For some reason, I just can't seem to come across a happy medium in the Cocama tank. Not sure what it is but I still can't get the asthetics where I want them in this tank. Still making progress though albeit very slowly. Think it is finally coming together.

Any of you Oto lovers out here, just so you know, the females run the show. My goodness it was just so fun to watch. I removed everything floating in this tank, did a little rescaping as well as the 20% wc. Started working on another tank and looked over there. They were all doing their customary laps around the tank. So I took a break and pulled up a seat not too far from them so I could observe better. There are three nice plump females in here and they were driving the boys crazy! One would have about 4-5 followers with here. Another female would swim by doing her "bump and run" thing and all the guys would then give chase. This went on for quite some time.

Back in the main breeder, mom and pop Oto are finally hangin out together again. They have been taking a break for a spell. We'll see where this goes.

[James0816]

Egg watch officially over ...... Mama's laying.

Heading out to the race today so did my checks early. Nice discovery. Very quick count yields (28) with (1) non viable. Unfortunately no time to get water parms. Temp is a nice 78 in the tank. I did catch that one. Everyone remaining active in the tank.

Activity levels in all the other tanks are up as well. On egg watch in the second breeder.

[andywoolloo]

I love this thread! thank you very much for sharing it all with us.

My otos have reproduced but i have never seen any of it. No spawning or eggs, just wee otos here and there all over.

[James0816]

Thanks. Been a fun little journey. Glad it is continuing.

I was obviously incorrect on the day of which mama laid the eggs. Must have been Thursday some time. Went down to check on things just a while ago and found fry. Best I could find was (14) at the moment. I'll check again later to see if I can get a better count.

Here's the best shot out of the group I just took.



And a shot of the current home front. I still need to trim more off the Subwassertang wall as you can see and move the Downoi forward a bit. Some trimming needs to be done as well.



Today was supposed to be a water change day but with the newly hatched fry, will just do a top off via slow drip as usual. Prepping zucchini and algae powder for feeding.

[jbmm]

we need a "I like this"-button here lovely thread to read!
keep us updated

[James0816]

Final check of the eve. Counted (23) wigglers. Most of them are in the Bacopa area. This has always been mama's favorite spot. No other good pics at the moment. Will be starting the drip of the top off water shortly. May make one check during this process. The other ladies are still plump and being that this was a small batch, I'm anticipating a bigger lay within the week.

Also have a few baby tiger shrimp as well. Must be a baby kinda day. Little tigers in this tank, little Blue Pearls in their tank, little CRS in their tank....lol....must be something in the water. ;)

[andywoolloo]

and nice picture, beautiful tank! and nice baby shot!

[Farid]

hi james,
as far i could read you didnt manage to raise any fry (i didnt read all the 7 pages for now...sorry if i'm wrong)

i raise all my sturisomas for example in a little glass tank that i use to hang into the main tank...an airdriven waterpipe delivers fresh water from the main tank! i never set up a little tank only for any fry, cause the waterquality goet down in very little time...

with my sturisoma fry i use a mixture of spirulina tabs from Sera and nori algae leaves (you'll get them in the asian store)...sushi stuff i guess you know what i mean.
i grind them all in a electrical coffee machine into powder. dayly i fed them about 3-4 times in little portions before each fedding time i brush the glass floor and to whirl the rest of the old food a bit up...most of it goes into the main tank.

if you dont want to hang a baby tank into the breeding tank you should set up a second big tank (enough big to run it with a big filter) and hang the baby tank in this one...maybe a water change from the adult tank into the fry tank might be better than...as the adult tank's quality will still be good, with the right parameters for the fry.

might be worth a try...

good luck
farid

[James0816]

Hi Farid. As a matter of fact, I have raised quite a few fry. Been selling off the older ones. Have a few left from previous batches. Just in time as more wigglers are in the tanks.

I would like to see more of you fry tank. I like the idea you mentioned.

[James0816]

Routine check looks good. Was able to physically count (21) wigglers. Mama, Pop and one of his mistresses are hanging out together. Looks like egg watch again.

Annnnnnnnnnd....over in the holding tank....wigglers! Found (4) in there. Most excellent. Never saw any eggs in this tank. They must have laid them all in the Java Fern this time.

Fed one tube of prepared powdered food to each tank. When it clears up a bit, I'll see if there may be any photo ops.