What is my catfish

[nicki]

I've been searching the internet for quite a while now trying to find out what breed of catfish I have.

It has blue and has thin white stripes going from head to tail, it's belly is white and has the normal whiskers a cat fish has and its 1ft long.

I can't find any pictures online and my digital camera is broken.

The reason I want to know is I am thinking about turning my tank into a cold water tank (approx 22 degrees C) and I don't know if he will survive in that temp water?

Any help would be great, thanks!

[MatsP]

That could be quite a few different things... Unfortunately, I think you will have to find a digital camera somewhere and take a photo.

--
Mats

[nicki]

I've used the camera on my phone, not brill but hopefully good enough to get an ID

[MatsP]

Ah, well, that's easy;

Platydoras armatulus

(most books etc would have it as Platydoras costatus, but someone figured out a couple of years ago that "this name has been wrongly used for a long time"), and no, probably won't work at 22'C in the long term.

--
Mats

[nicki]

thankyou!!!! been looking for aaaaages

How low do you think i could put the temp?

[MatsP]

What else are you planning to have with it - it may be better working from that direction, than the other way around...

--
Mats

[nicki]

http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/sp ... ies_id=880
that link says it can live in temp 23 - 30, will 1 degree really make a huge difference?

At the moment in the tank I have leopard danios, a silver shark, black neons, black moore and a yellow spotted puffer...

I have had no end of problems with running this tropical tank, I seem to have spurts of things dying, e.g ive just lost my 1/2ft pleco, 4 silver tip tetras (i think that's what they're called) 1 black tetras, and 8 neons in the last 48 hours. I don't know what going on, things will be fine for months then they all of a sudden start dying ... yet the water is clear and there are no signs before hand they are ill ... at first I thought my puffer was having a munch, however this time his belly is flat and empty so its not him.

My son has a cold water tank in his room which is slightly neglected, it has no filter, no light ... nothing, it's just a tank, with fish in it..he has 2 shubumbkins (sp) 1 chocolate oranda and a beautiful gold oranda which has black tips on all his fins and a black tip nose & a black star on top of his head (love him ... ) but those fish are perfectly happy, they have been in there for well over a year just being fed once a day and water changes every few weeks ... and the tank is so much prettier and colourful than my tropical tank. So I would like to turn my tank downstairs into coldwater so I could put those sorts of fish in their...

I have been told though that goldfish live in tropical water, however it speeds up their metabolism and they produce more waste and shortend their life span ...

Not really sure what to do, its an awkward situation

[MatsP]

Technically speaking, a cold-water tank is harder to manage than the same setup in tropical temperature - the reason for this is that whilst we call it "fishkeeping", it's actually on a technical aspect "bacteria keeping", because to keep the fish healthy, you need the filter to have "good bacteria". Failing to keep that bacteria healthy and happy will lead to all sorts of problems. And the bacteria reproduces and "works" slower at lower temperature - this is the main reason that coldwater tanks are recommended to be lower stocked for the same size tank.

Puffers are not really community fish, that is for certain - they will bite other fish, and considering that they are capable of eating all sorts of snails and shellfish, IF they bite something that is soft, like another fish, there will be some damage.

What size is your tank?
How often and how much do you do water changes?
What type of filtration are you using?

--
Mats

[nicki]

The filter I have is a tetratec easycrystal filterbox 300 (40-60ltr)
The temp is currently 27/28 degrees C
It is a 17 gallon tank, but taking account the space used up by filter, ornaments, plants etc there is morelikely 15/16 gallons in there.
I do 10liter water changes (roughly 15%) once a month sometimes longer.

I find the tropical tank quite boring, I can't seem to get anything in there that is attractive without dying. The longest living fish I have in there is my black moor who is nearly 3 years old - and he's supposed to be a cold water fish and apparently difficult to look after!!! Where as my pleco I bought not too long ago who was 1/2ft long and are supposidly hardy fish died today!!

[MatsP]

Right, I think we can explain why your fish are dying. I'd suggest 25% water changes once a week. I have tanks that get 50% water changes every week, and they are stocked less than what you describe, if your fish sizes are correct.

A fish that is half a foot long in a tank that is about 75 liter (sorry, I'm more of a metric than imperial measures person) is quite a big fish in a small tank. Given that you also do not make that much water changes, nitrate (which is what fish waste turns into when the bacteria works as it should) will build up.

And you've probably seen that new fish fare badly, but the fish you've had for quite some time stays on in the tank - this is a typical consequence of "old tank with not enough water changes".

And your filter is under-size. Bearing in mind that in the common experience of this forum is that most filters are undersize even when you use them for the "right" size.

Please do not think I'm saying "you are doing it all wrong" - well, I am, in a way, but only because no one has told you to do it differently.

--
Mats

[nicki]

I'm not thinking at all you are telling me i'm doing it all wrong I've asked for then help and you are doing so - and thankyou!!

I have though about rehoming my catfish, but I've had him for a long time and he's much loved, however I understand that he is now to big for my tank at a foot long. I just can't bring myself to do it! One parts of me is saying it's better for him, the other half is saying I love him sooo much! guess I have to do whats right for him

Regarding gallons/liters and my filter ... I have a 70liter tank, -room taken by fish,ornament etc that i mentioned before, and i forgot to mention it's not quite full to the top due to my makeshift lid which results in the light being submerged if full (not a good idea) because my son stood on the lid a few months back and broke it. I think it goes down to, if not less than 60liters...So a 40-60liter filter still not enough?

You are also correct about new fish not thriving, infact they die within days of being introduced.

I feel like a complete novice all of a sudden and i've been keeping fish for years!


Are there any tropical fish you would recommend that would put some colour to my tank, which is my main reason for wanting to go coldwater because the fish are much prettier and seem easier to look after. as i said my sons tank has 4 gold fish, no filter, no light, and are happier than my tropical which has filter, heater, light and 2 bubble walls...

Thanks for all the help, it's great!

[MatsP]

For all things that are "bad" about them, goldfish tolerate dirty water very well.

And yes, a 40-60 liter filter is almost certainly too small for a 70 liter tank - the manufacturer already take into account that your tank will have a few bits and pieces in it. Especially if you have big and/or dirty fishes in the tank - large pleco, Platydoras that is very large, etc.

And if your fish is really a foot long, then a 70 liter tank is not just a bit too small, but WAY too small. In my book, a 1ft fish should have a tank that is 4ft x 2ft x 2ft - this means 100 imperial gallon, or 450 liter. However, a lot of people have a tendency to get fish sizes wrong when looking through the glass at the fish - when you actually get them alongside a tape-measure or a ruler, they are a fair bit shorter than the owner said - happens all the time... However, the size of tank I'd recommend is at least 4L x 2L x 2L, where L is the length of the fish. And if your fish is at least half the size you said, your tank is on the small side...

--
Mats

[nicki]

Thanks for all your help, it's put alot of things into perspective for me.

Back to my original idea though, would it be possible/ok so slowly lower my tank down to around 22 degrees C and turn it into a coldwater tank. Even if it means rehoming my catfish and waiting for a few of the others to die off before doing so, would the fish i have survive in that temp? and vice versa, the cold water fish in that temp

I'm having a water test done tomorrow, but I have dont my PH, both tanks are at 6.5

[MatsP]

I'm pretty sure that the water in Worcester is pretty hard - in which case a pH of 6.5 clearly indicates that the water is "very old" - pH falls as the water gets old.

As to changing the tank for cold water, sure, if you get rid of any fish that doesn't like cooler water, I don't see why not. Bear in mind, however, that if you plan on keeping goldfish, the recommendation is at least 80 liter, and a minimum of 40 liter per fish - so you could POSSIBLY get away with two goldfish in your tank. I'm not an expert on coldwater tanks, but it's my honest opinion that it's easier to keep tropical fish than coldwater fish - and I bet if you tried to introduce another fish to your son's tank, it would not survive - because the fish are kept in very polluted water, and the fish have got used to it - but introducing new fish will not work. It's not because it's coldwater your son's tank is working - it's because the goldfish are used to the conditions in that tank - I would recommend making water changes, but don't make any sudden large changes...

--
Mats

[nicki]

It's all making sense now its being explained! I'll start with the more frequent water changes in hope that my fish will start to thrive. The same with my sons tank.

I shall also look into rehoming my catfish, as loved as he is.

As for my sons tank and introducing new fish, a shubumbkin was introduced about a month ago and seems happy enough ... however i agree, more care must be taken!

And regarding the PH and hard water ... the water out of my tank is 7.0 ... don't know if that makes any difference to the hardness of my water

Thanks again for all the help

[nicki]

Also, can you suggest any fish to brighten up my tropical tank ? I'd like to make it a lil more colourful once I've got it sorted, it's all blacks and greys at the moment.

[MatsP]

Water out of your tank or your tap? If the tap-water is 7.0, then it's not very hard...

But either way, I'd say start changing about 20-25% of the water each week - it should make your fish happier.

And I'm sure you can find a good home for your Platydoras - either take it to your local shop (just don't expect them to give you any money/credit for it).

Also, if you want a fish to eat algae in the tank, don't get a large pleco - get some

Ancistrus cf_cirrhosus

- they are relatively inexpensive & hardy fish - but don't grow too large for a 70 liter tank.

As to recommendations for colourful fish - I'd probably go with some tetras - however, the Platydoras may go for small tetras, so you should perhaps consider something with a slightly taller body. Go to your LFS ("Local Fish Shop") and have a look at what they have - if you trust them, ask for their suggestions, if not, ask here. There are also some nicely coloured platies and mollies around - they do better in hard water...

But do not buy any new fish until you have a good level of nitrate in the tank - that should ideally be less than 30 ppm, but it can be hard to get there. It shoould certainly be under 50.

Bear in mind that I'm a catfish keeper, and the last few fish I bought are

Mystus mysticetus

,

Orinocodoras eigenmanni

,

Dekeyseria sp(L052)

,

Ancistrus dolichopterus

,

Ancistrus sp(L338)

,

Hemiancistrus guahiborum

(newest to oldest order).

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Mats

[nicki]

sorry, I did mean 7.0 out of my tap, not tank!

Thank you so much for your help, I shall try to find a nice new home for my catfish ... We have a 6ft tank at work, I'll ask if they would like a donation!

I'm off now, I'm up for work at 7 ... I'll ask them tomorrow if they'd like my big guy, at least then I still get to see him!!

Thankyou

Nicki

[Suckermouth]

Wait a second, could you look closely at the white stripe? Are there black spots in it? It looks like there are in your pic, but I'm not sure. If there are black spots, it is NOT P. armatulus, and is more like P. hancockii. I doubt it, however. AFAIK P. hancockii is exceedingly uncommon in the hobby, and by contrast P. armatulus is extremely common.

Care would be identical for the two species, if I'm not mistaken, so it shouldn't make much of a difference as far as that goes.

[racoll]

Hi Nicki.

Please don't take this at all personally (as we all had to start somewhere ), but you really couldn't be keeping a worse collection of fish together, size, stocking, water conditions, and temperament wise.

I recommend you rehome all of them before any more die, and start afresh, with livestock suitable for your size tank.

I would also change your fish supplier, as the selling/recommending of these animals to you is simply appalling. The Maidenhead Aquatics stores are generally very good.

If you want a nice looking, easy to maintain tank, with colourful active fishes, think about the following stock:

16x glowlight danios (Danio choprae) or 8 Odessa barbs (Puntius padamya)
2x common bristlenose (

Ancistrus cf_cirrhosus

)
6x

Corydoras

spp.

Decorate with 2cm of silver sand, a dozen round stones, and a couple of chunks of bogwood.
Plant with Anubias and java fern.
Change 25% of the water weekly (use a dechlorinator).
Keep the water at 22-23C.

I personally guarantee you will never have a problem again with this setup.

Hope this helps Nicki

[nicki]

Thanks for the help.

I have since set up another tank and removed my danios into a different tank, did it all properly, left it 24 hrs & even used the safe water stuff and floated the fish for a while ... all seen OK so far, happyily swimming round, inc my catfish!
remaining in my tropical tank now is my silver shark, black moor, green spotted puffer, black tetra and catfish, although it now seems rather empty the fish seem happier in both tanks!

I also got my water tested was REALLY bad tbf:
Tropical Tank
Nitrit - 1.6
Amonia - 1.2
PH 7.5
Didn't see the point in doing Nitrate as other were so off ... but it explains the fish deaths ... I'm gonna do water changes over the next few days to sort this out and hopefully stablalize my tank now some fish have been moved

My cold water tank on the other hand which is rather neglegted with 4 goldfish, no filter/light etc
Nitrit - 0.1
amonia 0
Nitrate 20
PH 7.5

So ... all is well in the world of coldwater tank ... seems to be rather well established!

Shall get the water tested in my topical tank next week after a few water changes, and see how things are looking, then leave it alone for a while and see how it goes, see if I can get it established ...
Me and my husband are also going to look into getting a bigger fishtank...Money is an issue though, will take some saving up!!!

[nicki]

Also, as for the species ... Isn't Platydoras hancockii a tiny lil thing? grows to about 4 inches or so?? My big guy is a ft long...

[Suckermouth]

Also, as for the species ... Isn't Platydoras hancockii a tiny lil thing? grows to about 4 inches or so?? My big guy is a ft long...

I haven't seen a 12" one, but they get at least about 6" long (not including tail)...? They're not tiny IMO, anyway.