More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

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bekateen
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More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Hi Jools,

Today I noticed that the distribution map for the subfamily Callichthyinae shows an inordinately high number of drop pins. I suspect it's showing corys too. At the same time, for a while now the Loricariidae don't even plot a a map.

Cheers, Eric
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

You know, subfamilies could never have worked, but all the code was in place to support it - was just missing the final piece. So, after a bit of sleuthing, a relatively simple thing to fix.

Will look at the Loricaridae map next...

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Jools wrote: Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:51 pmYou know, subfamilies could never have worked, but all the code was in place to support it
If I'm reading you correctly, :)) :)) :))

Thanks. And Cheers,
Eric
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

I am too literal. :-) So, families are fixed up now too but the mega family that is the Loricariidae still won't work. I think it's something in the data. The document tree is 211363 characters, it will take me some time to check it...

Here's a sample:

Code: Select all

<div id="xmlparser">
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<name>Harttiella lucifer</name>
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<longitude>-76.6277</longitude>
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<latitude>10.3582</latitude>
<longitude>-66.3208</longitude>
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<longitude>-76.1877</longitude>
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<longitude>-62.9442</longitude>
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<latitude>0.036736</latitude>
<longitude>-65.0635</longitude>
<type>occurrence</type>
<name>Marauiá Exastilithoxus hoedemani</name>
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<marker>
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<longitude>-60.0538</longitude>
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<longitude>-79.0765</longitude>
<type>occurrence</type>
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<latitude>-23.0434</latitude>
<longitude>-44.6889</longitude>
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<marker>
<latitude>-23.2271</latitude>
<longitude>-44.7804</longitude>
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<longitude>-43.766</longitude>
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<longitude>-54.3489</longitude>
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<name>Mapaoni Guyanancistrus tenuis</name>
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<longitude>-64.2502</longitude>
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<longitude>-64.533</longitude>
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<longitude>-40.5756</longitude>
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<name>Jequitinhonha Delturus brevis</name>
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<longitude>-73.2825</longitude>
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<name>Colombia Caribbean Rivers Sturisomatichthys panamensis</name>
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<name>Ecuador Pacific Coast Rivers Sturisomatichthys panamensis Sturisomatichthys frenatus Isorineloricaria spinosissima</name>
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<name>Javaés Spectracanthicus javae</name>
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</div>
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

The loricariidae have been broken for some time now, but didn't used to be (obviously). I don't recall it breaking after an update, but who knows about that. Rather, I was wondering if it could be a single flawed data point for one of the newer species added a few months back. Could a data point break the whole map? Or does it necessarily have to reside in the code?

Could it be a max size limit for number of points to plot? Something like that?

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

An interesting aside as you talk about the subfamilies not working before your fix today:

Here is my original report of the Loricariidae map being broken (viewtopic.php?f=36&t=48478) in May 2020. In that report, I mention that the Loricariinae map IS working but the Hypostominae map is broken. Go figure.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

Then, in your second post, you say the Loricariinae map is broken? So, I think maybe the page was in flux at that time - anyway, is now sorted.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Jools wrote: Mon Sep 28, 2020 10:26 pmThen, in your second post, you say the Loricariinae map is broken? So, I think maybe the page was in flux at that time - anyway, is now sorted.
Did I mistype? Please allow me to start over, so that we don't need to refer to the posts above:

Yesterday I discovered that the Callichthyinae subfamily was mapping too many points- I speculate that it was mapping either the entire Callichthyidae family or possibly it was mapping the Corydoradinae subfamily; I couldn't distinguish between the two options because I was viewing the pages on my phone (the pins don't show species when viewed on a phone).

Today I added the info that the whole family Loricariidae is broken since at least last May, but even back then, the subfamily Loricariinae was working, and it still is (along with all the other Loricariid subfamilies EXCEPT Hypostominae).

Today, in response to your comment that the program wasn't set up for subfamilies, I was saying that it is then all the more weird that the Callichthyinae subfamily was broken yesterday, when you then recognize that most of the Loricariid subfamilies were mapping fine yesterday, and in fact even back in May those subfamilies worked. That's what I meant to communicate.

The Callichthyinae seems to be fixed now, as you reported.

However, when I check the Loricariidae family page, the map doesn't populate. Likewise, the Hypostominae subfamily map doesn't populate either, even though all the other subfamilies of the Loricariidae do work, and they've worked since last May. So I suspect that the problem might rest in the Hypostominae.

Does that make more sense?

Sorry for the confusion.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

Yes, that does, it's as you say, there is a data issue (or the software is not robust enough to deal with it) in the subfamily Hypostominae.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

Ok, so I've fixed the problem. It was caused by the text "bearing 269°" in the type locality for Hypostomus hemicochliodon. It was the 329th entry in the list....

So the maps works. However, and I know this now shows other "bad data" with plecos in parts of the world they should not be. This is a separate issue which I have been aware of for a long time. The map makes South America look very busy and I will, in the future, consider pin clustering as per the undernoted:

https://developers.google.com/maps/docu ... javascript

However, for now, this beast is slain.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Awesome fix! Thanks, Jools.

FWIW, I don't mind the map of So. America looking very busy, as zooming in is sufficient to clarify. I routinely use the maps here and at GBIF to attempt to identify species for myself and for others. The graphical presentation of the maps are invaluable, since I don't have the locations of the rivers memorized in any helpful way. I'm a visual thinker and visual learner.

Whether you choose to pursue the cleaning up of the pins is up to you. But just know I personally don't see it as an improvement. In fact, if pins are pooled together, it would initially mask information until the pins are untangled fully with (potentially) strong zoom: Even a little zoom can start to spread nearby pins apart, so their placement begins to clarify with event the slightest zoom. But by contrast, as I practice with the sample provided in your link, some of the pins don't disentangle until you've zoomed way in on the map, which then automatically hides other areas of the map because of the intensity of the zoom. Since both conditions are disentangled by zooming, and since the current state of maps starts to disentangle with even minor zooming, I see no benefit myself to the clustering of pins... but that's just my two cents.

Thanks again.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

OK, that's useful feedback. More important is finding these "errant" species that are all over the globe and working why our parsing of the lat/long info isn't correct in those instances. I think there are several bug reports for this, so will get on to them soon.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

I'd be happy to help with the repair of the errant type locality data, except that I'm not empowered to make those changes. But what I can do is assemble a spreadsheet of the species, their inaccurate coordinates and what the likely coordinates should be. You could then simply apply them without having to use your time to track down the info.

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

We can work out a way to empower you. :-) How about we start with a wrong one and figure it out. Any candidates?

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Parotocinclus bahiensis

The coordinates listed on the CLOG are:
  • -40.183611, -10.413611
I suspect the two numbers are simply reversed and should be:
  • -10.413611, -40.183611
FWIW, the inaccurate pairing is present both in the data fields for type locality Lat/Long and also in the text field of the type locality
Rio Itapicuru, on Federal highway BR 407, 8 kilometers north of Senhor do Bonfim to Juazeiro, Bahia State, Brazil, 40°11'01"S, 10°24'49"W.
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

Yes, got it in one and this is the main issue. Here, the problem is simply our software interprets the type locality and maps it onto the species page. That the authors have messed up the locality is not something a computer is going to understand without a lot more support (although it might be able to swap them if S/N is before W/E, not sure needs research). So, what I need to do is be able to edit the co-ords even if the type locality is wrong. This is where we can empower a data submission/admin to help...

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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Jools wrote: Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:57 pmSo, what I need to do is be able to edit the co-ords even if the type locality is wrong. This is where we can empower a data submission/admin to help...
Currently, on the CLOG edit page, there are two boxes on the right side displaying the Lat/Long on record for type locality. I've learned in the past (when I tried to change the record for Pseudacanthicus leopardus, if I recall correctly) that these two fields are NOT interactive, but merely for information purposes only - they display the coordinates on record in the database, but they do not have an input/edit functionality. Would you be able to change that, so I could type in revised Lat/Long data into those fields? Or do you think that's too unregulated a power?
Uncle Ben Parker wrote:With great power comes great responsibility.

Changing the subject slightly, ... thinking beyond PlanetCatfish - When we identify data errors like this, is there a mechanism on the source end for us to submit our corrections to the place that's providing the original (erroneous) data?

Cheers, Eric
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by Jools »

Hi Eric,

Yes, there needs to be some way to interact with the lat/long data through the data submission / vetting process. That's what I plan to look at initially.

So, the source can come from different places. However, these ones are from the description, so the best I suspect you could do is go to the lead author and say, "Hey, next time you do one of these, how about doing it this way...". I don't know how that would be received or ultimately how useful it would be. There are some where is source is CoF. I'm in touch with them (Richard) from time to time, maybe 2 or 3 times a year with corrections as I find them. They appear to be appreciative of the input.

I have written a geodata checker which find all species with suspect data. I can share that with you too if that'd provide background? Might save you some work on your list?

Jools
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

Hi Jools,

Sure if it's not too much trouble, I'd be willing to try the geodata tracker.

Thanks, Eric
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Re: More Callichthyinae than I can imagine? (But no loricariids)

Post by bekateen »

To redirect slightly, finding the problems is easy and quick - Just view the family maps and hover over the pins that aren't over the right continent. The work is figuring out what the corrected data values should be. Sometimes it's obvious; sometimes not.

Cheers, Eric
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