Plec id please!!!!

[st24rsap]

I am new to this site so a quick hello to everyone.

I have 3 of these bristlenose plecs and am urgently trying to find out what type they are. All 3 are about 4 inches in length and i think are some sort of small bristlenose, beleived all to be females

[MatsP]

Difficult to say, as there are several "black or dark brown with small white spots". But it looks like

Ancistrus punctatus

, perhaps.

Without a capture location, it can be very hard to say.

--
Mats

[MatsP]

Another option would be:

Ancistrus sp`rio_ucayali`

--
Mats

[st24rsap]

Another option would be:

Ancistrus sp`rio_ucayali`

--
Mats

yeah that names come up a couple times. i thought initially they were starlight bristlenose plecs untill i went to buy a male from another forum and it was pointed out that they probably wernt starlights

[Loracidlover]

I would say Ancistrus sp. rio ucayali for sure, I have one identical to yours which I believe is ancistrus sp. rio ucayali.

[MatsP]

I'm not saying you're wrong, Loricariidlover, but "looks the same" may not be sufficient to identify Ancistrus species - there are several that "look the same" from various places. The only really sure method is either clear scientific approach, where you find some paper describing the species, and use the information there to determine the species. This can be hard without a capture location, as similar species from different places may have very minor differences, and thus not be identifiable without the capture location. [And often, the evidence of one species versus another can be hard to determine without killing the fish, as some of the "proper ID" is based on proportions between bones and other internal features].

The other approach also involves the capture location, and that is to combine the capture location with "looks like" information, and thus come to a conclusion.

Of course, in the case of A. sp rio ucayali, there is no scientific description, so there's no good way to determine if it is this species or not, besides knowing exactly where it was caught. Not all shops/wholesalers are even able to give this info.

--
Mats

[st24rsap]

unfortinately the plecs were bought several months back so i wont be able to get any information about them from the fish store, looks like i will just have to go with rio_ucayali.

i would love to try breeding them but i think i have 3 females due to the lack of bristles. is it posible to cross breed plecs or will they only breed with others of the same species?

[MatsP]

It is certainly possible [and not at all desirable] to create hybrids of certain forms of Loricariidae - highly likely that Ancistrus can do this. Best to make sure you get your males from the same shop and wholesaler to give a better chance of getting the same species.

--
Mats

[st24rsap]

i will keep my eyes open at the same shop and try to get hold of some males of the same species if they are sexed easily ?

[MatsP]

I worked out about 5-6 different points of "sexing ancistrus" that can be used for both small and large species - obviously, larger specimens are easier to determine, but small ones should be possible with those keys [particularly reliable when combining multiple keys in the same direction]. It's in the FAQ [under Help!] in the Husbandry->Loricariidae section.

--
Mats

[st24rsap]

cant seem to open the FAQ

i popped to my lfs that i purchased them from originally and they had loads of the same type there but all females and they couldnt give me any more info other than them being Ancistrus sp of some sort

i have 2 other plecs that i think are a male and female L088, i will post some pics later and hopefully someone can confirm this as well

[st24rsap]

here are the other 2 plecs that i believe are L088's. Im new to plecs so any information is greatfully apreciated

Female


Male


Both togehter, although looking at this pic not so sure they are same species

[MatsP]

I'd be very tempted to call those two

Ancistrus sp(3)

- but it's hard to say - all Ancistrus are quite difficult to identify, because they are quite able to change colour and are all fairly similar [with a few rare exceptions].

--
Mats

[st24rsap]

looking through the pics of the Ancistrus sp. (3) the female does look a lot like the Piebald variety
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/im ... ge_id=7802

and the male looks very similar to the male Ancistrus sp. (3)
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/im ... ge_id=1831

[MatsP]

I think the female looks more like stress-colouration than a piebald variety...

--
Mats

[Loracidlover]

Mats, as training biologist/geneticist I am well aware that a "looks like" comparison is somewhat hit and miss when identifying a species, and understand what a "clear scientific approach" consists of, but in this case, as you yourself pointed out there is little else to go on - hence my suggestion.
Firstly I am aware that musculature and cranial structure is often used for identification purposes, but I am sure the owner does not want to kill his fish to use internal features to identify the fish.
Also, knowing that taxonomy and literature concerning Loricariidae is poor, to the extent that this fish is currently unclassified, as such I am unable to point the owner in the direction of relevant papers for identification purposes - hence it was not suggested.
As you pointed out catch location is a useful identification aid, but knowing how clueless alot of shops can be about this it is normally not "scientifically" viable.

With this in mind i think a "looks like" comparison, unfortunately, is often all that is possible for identifaction of many Loricariids.

Conrad