Red Titanic L-273

[DRJplec]

Hey im rhys

Im new to all this but am hoping to source some red titanic pleco for breeding but i have been looking everywhere but i can not find any

Just wondering if anyone new of any ?

Thank you

[MatsP]

Do you mean

L273

?

--
Mats

[DRJplec]

No 274

Cant upload pic to show you sorry

Thanks

[DRJplec]

After looking the 273 and the image ive got they look about the same except the rear fins are the oppersite way round big on top small on bottom and the oppersit


But could be the differance between male or female

Any ideas ?


Thanks

[MatsP]

L274 is a black Baryancistrus with large white spots, similar to

Baryancistrus sp(L142)

("Snow ball pleco"), so it is NOTHING like

L273

. We don't have a picture for L274 (and my first search didn't find a correct picture either).

Here's the German L-welse site's page for L274.
http://www.l-welse.com/reviewpost/showp ... roduct/289

The pictures we have for L273 are quite variable, and I'm pretty sure the fin-extensions will vary a bit as to whether the lower or upper one is longer. It also seems that mature fish often have shorter fin extensions than the juveniles. Whether this is due to damage as they grow, or always happens as they grow older, I'm not sure.

This species is illegal to export from Brazil, which may explain why they are even harder than before to find.

--
Mats

[DRJplec]

My appolagies you are correct the other website was miss leading it is an 273

Thank you for your help

Dont suppose anyone nows where i can get one ?


Thank you

[MatsP]

Don't know of anywhere one is for sale. They are definitely not common...

Not common even before the stricter checks on the export of "non-listed species" - people say Brazil banned export a few years back, but technically, they just made sure what was exported was allowed to be exported - there is a list of "allowed species", and if it's not on that list, it's not allowed for export. The list can be found here: http://www.ibama.gov.br/recursos-pesque ... inental/1/

It was drawn up in 2003-2004, as far as I can tell (reading Portuguese isn't my strongest point!), and anything not on that list has been forbidden to export ever since [and I think before that too, but the list was even shorter then!].

--
Mats

[DRJplec]

Just my luck that is lol i will never find a pair to breed what others would you recommend except
The zebra pleco for breeding have to be rare tho got a few comman ones


Thanks

[MatsP]

Rare as in "not been bred" or as in "not many people keep them"?

There are lots of pleco species that match either or both of these meanings for rare. [And you may even mean something else again].

One would also ask "how rare"?

It's very hard to suggest fish for other people to keep/breed, because after all, you also have to like the fish, and we all like slightly (or very) different things. I love Leporacanthicus, and several of those are not commonly bred, but most species are relatively easy to find in shops.

--
Mats

[DRJplec]

I mean the ones that are not comman or never stocked in shops due to there lack of breeds and are almost inpossable to find


Thanks


The L046 round here are like 85 pound a peace and very hard to get hold of

[MatsP]

The reason H. zebra are expensive is two things:
1. They are illegal to export from Brazil (as explained above).
2. They breed in small numbers (typically 10-15 per brood, and 1-2 broods per year), and the babies grow slowly.
3. They look fantastic, and thus people want them.

There are lots of L-numbers (and scientifically described species) that are nearly never seen in the hobby. Just look at the number of L-numbers where we don't have any or only a couple of pictures (unfortunately, we don't have a search function for "no pictures"). Also, if you look at a list of

Loricariidae

, the ones which say "k: 0", have no keepers registered here (doesn't mean there are NONE sold, just that no owner has registered themselves in our "my cats" register). As a comparison, this species has 35 keepers.

Edit: In the above listing, you can also see number of images as "i: <some number>". Fish with no images will have "I: 0". We take almost any picture until we get 12, so if a species has less than 12 images, it's probably not easily found.

--
Mats

[DRJplec]

Thank you very much for you help matsp

[RickE]

The reason H. zebra are expensive is two things:
1. They are illegal to export from Brazil (as explained above).
--
Mats

Interesting you should reiterate that Mats.

http://thepieraquatics.blogspot.com/201 ... -wild.html

I don't understand how these can be openly advertised as wild.

[MatsP]

They are illegal to export from Brazil. It is not illegal to import them into England. So if they have been smuggled out of Brazil to, for example, Colombia, then it is perfectly legal to import them into England (or any other country, with a notable exception of the USA which has a special legislation that makes it illegal to import any plant or animal that is illegal to export in the originating country). We have had several discussions about this in the past, and I'm not going to let this thread divert into a thread about "is it ethically right to import fish that are illegal to export from it's wild location". I have my opinion, and if you search the forum, I'm sure you can find one of the other threads on the subject - feel free to resuscitate one of those if you like.

--
Mats

[RickE]

I'd forgotten that 'loophole'!

Fair comment about not side-tracking the topic. I just happened to see the L46 on Pier's website at the same time as reading your post.