What is a good tankmate for Centromochlus perugiae?

[bekateen]

Hi All,

So in the near future I'll have a chance to go to the WetSpot tropical fish store in Oregon. Right now they have oil cats

Centromochlus perugiae

, which were on my Christmas wish list last year (http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... 73#p280173) and I've set up a tank so that I can get 4-6 of them. I've read their CLOG and the Shane's world article about them (here) and I've read some of the forum posts on these little guys... I "think" I'm ready (yeah, that's probably an overstatement).

I haven't finished decorating the tank yet; so far I have a thin layer of sand on the bottom and a mix of small, medium, and large round rocks across the floor. I'm planning to add several pieces of tangled driftwood and some bamboo and plastic pipes (some at ground level, some nearer to water surface. The tank has an HOB on the outside and a Fluval Sea Circulation Pump to create a directed current. Currently no plants are planned, but I'm open to the idea.

If wise, I'd like to keep 3-4 of one species of a loricariid with them in their tank, based on WetSpot's current selection. Some of these I've asked about here before, some are new ideas. I'd like to know which of these (if any) would make good tank mates for oil cats. And if not these, what else? This list is approximately in the order of my interest level, but I'm very flexible; right now, all of these loricariids are 2-3 inches TL in size. This tank is a 20 gallon tank, but I'm prepared to upsize it to as big as 55 gal as the loricariids grow.

Hemiancistrus guahiborum

Panaqolus albivermis

Peckoltia lineola

Chaetostoma aff_milesi

Also, for the oil cats, which is better for a group, fewer (4) or more (6)?

Thanks again. Cheers,
Eric

P.S., @admin, would you please be so kind as to move this post from Speak Easy to South American Catfishes (Everything Else)? I think in hindsight that I posted in the wrong thread. Thanks so much, Eric

[dw1305]

Hi all,
I'd go for

Corydoras pygmaeus

(or

Corydoras habrosus

) as tank mates for a bit of day-time interest, and I'd add some floating plants, mainly because they make maintaining high quality water easier, and may add hiding places for any Centromochlus fry. You would need to maintain some clear water surface.

The other thing I would definitely have is a vestigial winged Drosophila culture.

cheers Darrel

[panaque]

The only real issue I can foresee is when a loricariid tries to take over a closed-end tube occupied by a C. perugiae, especially a female with eggs/fry. If the loricariids are large enough not the be interested in the tubes there should be no problem. I have kept them successfully alongside

Peckoltia compta

.
I would avoid Chaetostoma as these would like their water cooler than the oil cats.
I think that there would be no problem keeping 6 oil cats in your tank and a larger group is more fun. Make sure there are enough hiding places and have some tubes open on both sides and some only open on one side. The latter are preferred by breeding females.

[bekateen]

Thanks Darrel and panaque for your replies.

The only real issue I can foresee is when a loricariid tries to take over a closed-end tube occupied by a C. perugiae

It's my experience with my clown plecos and albino BNs that they generally don't show interest in closed tubes that are significantly elevated off of the tank floor (e.g., about half-way up the water column, from the tank floor to the water surface). Is this something I might still face with the species listed above?

Also, is the Hemiancistrus guahiborum getting too big to be around oil cats? On it's CLOG, I see Hemiancistrus guahiborum approaches 6 inches SL. But in an earlier post (http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... 0&p=284454), PlecosAndLoaches stated

The profile says they grow to 5.9", but I've never seen them bigger than 4".

I can't speak to the validity of this, but if it's true that would certainly be a positive for me.

Cheers, Eric

[bekateen]

The other thing I would definitely have is a vestigial winged Drosophila culture.

Hi Darrel,

Would this be only for fry, or would this also be necessary for adults. I ask because I don't mind going to such lengths if and when spawning occurs, but I don't think I would want to maintain such a colony for every-day feeding of the adults. It is not my impression that the adults would be so selective in their feeding choices.

Cheers, Eric

[CharlieM9]

The other thing I would definitely have is a vestigial winged Drosophila culture.

Hi Darrel,

Would this be only for fry, or would this also be necessary for adults. I ask because I don't mind going to such lengths if and when spawning occurs, but I don't think I would want to maintain such a colony for every-day feeding of the adults. It is not my impression that the adults would be so selective in their feeding choices.

Cheers, Eric

Eric,

These are a largely over looked fantastic food for lots of different fish. As these little woodcats are predominantly nocturnal inscetivores in the wild it may be worth the extra effort to maintain cultures. Also daphnia may be very appreciated by them if possible, but the fruit flys are better nutrition than the daphnia.

Charlie

[panaque]

I've only seen my ol cats occupy tubes near the bottom.
I feed mine various frozen mosquito larvae and blood worm. They do well on that. Occasionally I get small crickets from the reptile shop. I feed these on flake food for 24 hrs, then freeze them. The oil cats love them. Floating foods are best but they learn to forage on the bottom after a while or they will take food from between your fingers - they are not shy.

[bekateen]

Thanks Charlie and panaque for the extra info on food. Do oil cats like live Tubifex worms? I do keep and use frozen blood worms (mosquito larvae) and frozen brine shrimp, but I prefer to feed my other cats live Tubifex, and that was my plan for the oil cats.

I've only seen my ol cats occupy tubes near the bottom.

Interesting - I wouldn't have expected that. From a couple of other Shane's world articles, I was contemplating gluing some stones to the back upright wall of the aquarium to simulate a riverbank and mixing some tubes in there. Since the oil cats are top-feeders, I was expecting them to appreciate tubes/caves/hiding places that are more mid-water column height and even close to the surface (by the way, by "mid-water" I do not mean "open water" - as you can see now I still mean up against a wall).

Cheers, Eric

[CharlieM9]

Thanks Charlie and panaque for the extra info on food. Do oil cats like live Tubifex worms? I do keep and use frozen blood worms (mosquito larvae) and frozen brine shrimp, but I prefer to feed my other cats live Tubifex, and that was my plan for the oil cats.

Cheers, Eric

Eric,

The blood worms would be a great treat for them also! I would imagine you could pellet train them rather quickly though and then feed blood worms or tubifex/blackworms as treats? NLS Thera A+ has always been a pretty good go to weening pellet/food for me, but the repashy gels are also excellent at this as you could even mix the frozen blood worms in while gelling then freeze the concoction in cubes.

[bekateen]

Thanks Charlie. That's a relief to hear.

I use NLS Thera A+ 1mm pellets with all my bottom feeders. I've not had the pleasure of trying Repashy foods before. I just bought some last month, but I gave them to another member of my fish club to introduce them to the product. So now I have to go buy more for myself. LOL.

FYI, if you ever breed banjo cats, the fry LOVE the 1mm Thera A+ pellets and live Tubifex! They will start to feed on these as soon as they can get them in their mouths.

Cheers, Eric

[dw1305]

Hi all,

Would this be only for fry, or would this also be necessary for adults.

I'd feed them to both. They are easy to keep going as cultures. I've only had the smaller Drosophila melanogaster, but I assume the larger wingless D. hydei would be as good for the adults.

I've never bothered with a commercial feed mix. I've made my own from "Weetabix" or "Rolled Oats" and fruit, usually Banana and Apple. I don't worry too much about the exact proportions, and they were just food-stuffs we usually have in the house.

When you initially start the culture you need a pinch of live yeast, but after that the yeast will travel with the flies when you re-culture.

I use 500g glass jars with a cut PPI20 sponge for a lid. It doesn't matter what you use as a lid, as long as it lets the air flow.

I've found that "wood wool" works much better than anything else for letting the flies pupate and perch.

The flies can't fly, but they can climb really quickly, so when I feed them I just take the lid off the jar over the tanks and wait until enough flies have climbed up and jumped into the tank (they "think" they can fly).

cheers Darrel

[bekateen]

Thanks, Darrel. That's very helpful.

[bekateen]

Home from Oregon with six

Centromochlus perugiae

! I can't believe how cute these little fish are! I have a mix of males and females, but they are so quick I don't know the exact ratio. Thank you WetSpot Tropical Fish Store. Dang, some of you have described the oil cats as "motor boats." I've had them out of the bag only an hour or two, and I can't agree more.

All fish survived a 2 day drive home to California with 3 teenage children in the car (I'm not sure what I'm saying there...).

They are a little skinny after the two day drive, but they are already feeding on frozen brine shrimp the first night home, so I'm hoping to fatten them up well.

I did not pick up any loricariids at WetSpot this time. I had decided to buy either

Peckoltia lineola

or

Hemiancistrus guahiborum

, depending on what I found at the store. Alas, they had only two Peckoltia lineola left in the store; I couldn't sex them, so I decided not to risk their purchase. Also, they had no Hemiancistrus guahiborum in their brick-and-mortar storefront (these were housed at the mail-order facility, so I didn't have access), so I couldn't get those. But I have a local store where I can get the Hemiancistrus guahiborum in the next day or so, and when I do the tank will be set.

Thanks for the advice, everyone! I'm sure I'll have more questions.

Cheers, Eric

P.S., It's funny how some old ideas come around and suddenly get re-presented as new ideas. Back in this thread (http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =5&t=41710), I was trying to help my son look for a pleco to buy which would be colorful and spotted like the gold nugget or attractive like the green phantom pleco. In http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... 10#p284454, @PlecosAndLoaches suggested Hemiancistrus guahiborum. We didn't take any action at the time to buy this fish (in fairness, we didn't have it in our local stores), but now... a few months later... here it is in our local stores and we have chosen this species to complete the Centromochlus perugiae tank... How coincidental. Thank you, @PlecosAndLoaches!

[bekateen]

Still waiting for the guahiborum to arrive at my LFS. In the meantime, the oil cats are settling in and fattening up nicely, with five golden tetras (

Hemigrammus rodwayi

) as tankmates. In this video, I've just added live Tubifex worms to the tank while the lights were off so the oil cats could feed, then at about 51 seconds into the video, I turned the light on to get the video. The oil cats never stop moving in the dark, but they virtually freeze when the lights come on. I apologize for the stress I know I caused the fish; but I couldn't get decent video in the dark.

https://youtu.be/Eu5XY3CFgmM