British catfish

[loachy_406]

Just as a matter of interest, does anyone know of any catfish species native to Britain?

[Shane]

Sorry, no native cats.
-Shane

[racoll]

No truly native catfish. The closest you'll get is the almost naturalised wels catfish

Silurus glanis

. This species is pretty widespread now and may even be breeding.

Many people consider this an "invasive" species, but Britain was not always an island (as little as 10,000 years ago during the last glaciation), and a huge river basin was thought to run through the English Channel. The fauna of Britain and mainland Europe is not too different, and species like the wels may have little impact on native assemblages.

It was probably too cold for the wels that far north, but this is worth considering when talking about "alien" species.

[Bas Pels]

It was probably too cold for the wels that far north, but this is worth considering when talking about "alien" species.

Once I heard rabbits did only invade Europe in the year 200 or so

Thus they are alien? I think they are not, as they managed on their own feet

Regarding the Siluris glanis, it is native in north-western Europe, apparently not in the UK, but as Racoll poiinted out, life could very well have gone slightly differently

[racoll]

Here's a map to illustrate:



And a link. http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi ... ogger.html

[Richard B]

Catfish Wels 62lb (28.123 kilo) R Garner, Withy Pool, Henlow, Beds 1997 is the current UK record.

I thought i had read in the fishing press about bullheads being caught occasionally in the uk but there appears no record for them???

[racoll]

I think the ictalurids were banned pretty quicky, and those that were present haven't seemed to have spread. Not even sure if there are even any left?

[loachy_406]

Thanks guys. I didn't really think there were any, but I just wanted to know.

[Richard B]

I really don't think there can be many, if any bullheads these days (?)

[Chrysichthys]

I think the ictalurids were banned pretty quicky, and those that were present haven't seemed to have spread. Not even sure if there are even any left?

If I recall an article in PFK correctly (and I could be wrong), they aren't actually illegal to keep; the shop needs to apply for a license, to be allowed to stock them. But hardly any ever do because there's no demand. If you do find some for sale at a licensed shop, you can buy them quite legally.

I'm sure it's illegal for all concerned to release them into the wild.

There's no restriction on Pseudobagrids that I know of, and you have to wonder if they have the potential to be invasive. But the government never closes the door before the horse bolts.

LATER EDIT: BTW, what's happened with the taxonomic status of Pelteobagrus and Pseudobagrus? They aren't in the Cat-eLog any more.

[Carp37]

I think the ictalurids were banned pretty quicky, and those that were present haven't seemed to have spread. Not even sure if there are even any left?

One of the angling societies I used to belong to had a lake in the midlands with a few bullhead catfish in- they were quite small (4"-6") and never seemed to grow much, but my dad caught 3 over a couple of years whilst fishing for roach, bream, carp etc. They may have gone missing during last year's floods, and they may not breed here, but they definitely are still around in small numbers in stillwaters where they've been introduced, presumably illegally. A couple of lakes we fished in France had masses of juveniles in- huge balls of thousands of fry/juveniles hanging together.

On the same note, does anyone know which coldwater cats are still available without a licence in the UK? I'd assumed channel cats had become restricted at the same time as bullheads, but apparently not as they had some at Wharf Aquatics a couple of years ago.

[racoll]

On the same note, does anyone know which coldwater cats are still available without a licence in the UK? I'd assumed channel cats had become restricted at the same time as bullheads, but apparently not as they had some at Wharf Aquatics a couple of years ago.

I think Chrysichthys is correct from what I read here: http://www.efishbusiness.co.uk/controls/part01.asp.

Note that: "Those wishing to keep grass carp, sturgeon / sterlet and ameiurid (ictalurid) catfish in garden ponds and indoor aquaria, or red shiners and fathead minnows (Roseyreds) in indoor aquaria (other than aquaria on retail or wholesale premises) are covered by a general licence and need not apply for individual licences."

[Carp37]

Thanks Rupert- I was assuming that bitterling, bullhead catfish etc. had disappeared from aquarium outlets due to the need for licences now; I hadn't noticed that weather loaches were also covered though. So this means that you're still supposed to apply for a general licence to keep grass carp or sturgeon? I've never seen anything suggesting that fact at garden centres/aquarium shops.

[racoll]

I hadn't noticed that weather loaches were also covered though

Yes the European weather loach Misgurnus fossilis is restricted. However the species we see in the shops is the Asian weather loach M. anguillicaudatus (not restricted).

The European weather loach is a much more attractive, golden striped fish, which I have never seen for sale.

So this means that you're still supposed to apply for a general licence to keep grass carp or sturgeon?

I was a bit confused as well. I think it just means that you don't have to apply for any licence.

[Carp37]

Thanks again- I think I'll need to ask regarding grass carp when I finally get my pond built, as these were one species I was interested in keeping.

Regarding weather loaches, I've not seen any for a while, so I'm not sure which species I used to see- I was under the impression they were fossilis I used to see, but that was 15-25 years ago!

[racoll]

M. fossilis


M. anguillicaudatus

[Carp37]

The ones I remember were fossilis looking at these- I remember preferring our native stone loaches to them.

[Bas Pels]

You are not allowed to keep Misgurnis as it has the potential to be invasive

We, on the other hand, are not allowed to keep them, as they are a threatened species - it is native here.

Strange, one would assume the conditions in the UK to be so similar to those on the continent, that an invasive species in the UK, would be hard to become endangered here

[racoll]

You are not allowed to keep Misgurnis as it has the potential to be invasive

In the UK we are allowed to keep M. anguillicaudatus, but not M. fossilis. You see them in most dealer's coldwater tanks.

Strange, one would assume the conditions in the UK to be so similar to those on the continent, that an invasive species in the UK, would be hard to become endangered here

The Netherlands is right on the western periphery of M. fossilis's distribution, so I guess it is very vulnerable to extirpation there.

Perhaps not an actual invasive species, just as you say, one with the potential to be.

[Carp37]

I'd be very surprised to see Misgurnis fossilis establish itself in the UK, but 20 years ago I'd have been very surprised to see bullhead catfishes establish themselves, whereas now I see them as a possibility if they were given the opportunity. Seeing the extent of the problem they can create in lakes in France, with literally thousands of fry on display in open water in big "bait balls", means that they only need a couple of successful spawns to establish themselves now that our winters are so much milder. It still irks me that I missed the chance to keep them then though, as they are a beuatiful fish.

As a matter of interest, was it black or brown bullhead catfish that were most often seen for sale when they were available?

[Richard B]

Ameiurus nebulosus

was most often seen (at least by me!) although

Ictalurus punctatus

was also often seen - i kept both in the past.

[Carp37]

Thanks Richard;

Ictalurus punctatus

was, I believe, the Channel catfish I spotted at Wharf a couple of weeks back- it surprised me that they weren't on the "licence needed" list; it's possible it was a different Ictalurus species though. Looking at the pics in the Cat-eLog I can't be sure whether it was

Ameiurus nebulosus

or

Ameiurus melas

I used to see, or have seen fishing in the UK and France- your suggestion is probably correct.

[Mod edit: Fix up broken tag --Mats]

[Phoxinus]

I live in Finland and we have Ameiurus nebulosus in my country. It has been introducted in the 1930s and it has been established in southern Finland, but it has been found even in the latitude 64°. So it is a very cold-tolerant species indeed!