overcrowded?

micahnathan · Post by **micahnathan** » 09 Jun 2003, 20:42

I have a 50 g. planted tank, and have slowly, and with much relish, been stocking it. And of course I'm now wondering if I've overstocked. Here's the roster:

2 5" common plecos
6 1" cardinal tetras
4 2" danios
1 8" geophagus
2 3" dwarf cichlids
1 3" green severum
1 4" bala shark
3 2" kuhli loaches
5 3" clown loaches
5 1" rainbow fish

Whew. Yeah, it seems like a lot. But I change approx. 10 g. a week (2.5 every day) and my fish all seem healthy and quite compatible. In fact, my theory is that having so many tank mates lowers stress, similar to the effect dithering fish have upon shy ones...

Anyway, just curious. Thanks for any feedback.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » 09 Jun 2003, 21:16

With good filtering and, as you say, regular water changes, i dont find that tank to be overcrowded.

Summing up total ammount of fish, i get 71" (180 cm) and thats imo suitable for a 50 gallon (175 L) tank.

In the early aqua litteratur i read, that you should not exceed 1 cm fish per 1 Liter of water. I still find this rule ok as a rough guideline when keeping small fish, but i must admitt having tanks that superseed this limit by far, as for example my Guppi-breeding tank.

Are you keeping big specimens, you ofcourse need more than 1 liter of water per centimeter fish

Most important will always be if the fish thrive.

Zack · Post by **Zack** » 09 Jun 2003, 22:14

Its fine for now, but when everything is full grown it most certainly wont be. Good luck

Sid Guppy · Post by **Sid Guppy** » 09 Jun 2003, 22:16

I DO find this tank overcrowded, and there are several fishes in there that aren't properly kept either.
Sorry but still:
175 liter isn't too much; the following fishes are already too big or will be pretty soon:
Geophagus sp is already 8", likely to reach 10-12"
Bala Shark (Balanthiocheilus melanopterus) will reach 1 foot in length
Common Plecs (Liposarcus pardalis) will reach 55 cm in length!!
Green Severum (Heros severus) will reach 8-10" and will be 6" high too, when adult
Clownloaches (Botia macracantha) will reach 10" to 1 foot in length

These are all fish that need a 200G when reaching maturity

Wich species are the "Dwarf cichlids"?

Other things:
Bala Shark: shoaler, properly kept at least 5-7, can eat small fish when growing up!
Clown loach: shoaler/grouper; at least 3-5
Geophagus and Severum, both bi-parentals, should be kept as such

I'm not saying that right now you don't do OK, but this tank is a potential disaster in the making; in the long run, several fish will get quite unhappy, and/or will make others quite unhappy. If you don't remove the species that'll get too big, fishdeaths will occur, prematurely.

Allan · Post by **Allan** » 09 Jun 2003, 23:14

Zack and Eurystomus......

I must hurry to admit, that you are both right. I didn't look at the species at all when replying.

I still dont find it overcrowded at the moment, but must admit that Eurystomus is right in every aspect, thanks for a better answer.

micahnathan · Post by **micahnathan** » 09 Jun 2003, 23:35

Thanks for all your feedback. Much appreciated.

I do have 5 clown loaches, so the grouping is taken care of, but the bala shark is all by its lonesome.

The dwarf cichlids consist of one apisto borelli, and one apisto caucatoides. The apisto c. has established his dominance a while back, so there's no problem there.

I've kept balas in the past (not one of my favorite fish, actually) and haven't had a problem with them eating smaller fish. But stranger things could happen...

As for the pleco size, I figure once they get huge I'll sell them to our LFS, which isn't one of those superstore monstrosities, but rather a privately-owned joint with decent people. Thing is, my plecos are growing oh-so-slowly, and hopefully I won't have to sell them back anytime soon.

As I stated before, there don't seem to be any behavioral problems (yet?). I'm no expert but I used to breed african cichlids back in college, and I've had this particular tank for nearly a year. In that time, I've lost one cardinal tetra, two clown loaches (internal parasites, I think), and I sold my other bala because he/she got too big. Besides that, everyone seems happy and healthy.

Although I'm done buying fish for this tank.

While I've got your collective attentions, does anyone know if breeding water bugs in an aquarium works? I'm looking for a "natural" live food supply, and besides the predatory water bugs, could I successfully have a small colony living in my tank for an indefinite amount of time?

Post by **Silurus** » 10 Jun 2003, 01:09

Breeding predatory water bugs is a bit iffy, since you have to provide food for the water bugs (other bugs/small fish) on a fairly constant basis.
A better source of natural live food would be something like gnat larvae (such as bloodworms or glassworms), although this is not something you can readily culture (but can at least purchase at a pet store).

Sid Guppy · Post by **Sid Guppy** » 10 Jun 2003, 21:23

Uhh, I think we're into manner of speech here; you mean waterFLEAS right? Daphnia? Cyclops?
That would be workable, although a leftover fishtank usually is too small, one of those small preshaped polyester ponds, though; that would work fine; just put it in a place where it gets plenty sunlights; Daphnia & Co eat unicellular algae, so if the water starts to turn green, you're on the right track!
Then put in a small portion of Daphnia or Cyclops and start from there. Usually Black mosqwuitolarvae turn up too, in such a pond (they even turn up in teacups left out in the garden!) and they're VERY good food too!

Especially because the adult female mosquito's look for you as foodsupply, so if you stay out in the garden every evening, you can be 100% sure, the Black mosquitolarvae turn up....

Sorry couldn't resist