gravid otos too big :-(

[L number Banana]

Still no luck with my VERY 'pregnant' otos
I don't know what else to do. I've tried a big water change (50%) with cooler, softer water, I also tried doing that when the barometer showed a big pressure drop, no luck. The unidentified ones seemed to lose their eggs (??) when I popped them into the hoplo tank, it didn't work with the O. vittata though and one is as big as a house and has spent the entire evening in the bubble stream of the airstone. Someone mentioned that they will die if they don't let the eggs go or spawn etc.

Has anyone experienced this? What else can I do? There's more in the store, should I get some new ones and hope for a friskier male?
Help!

[Mike_Noren]

I do not think they will die, with the exception of livebearers I have not known fish to become egg-bound like reptiles and birds.

If they are ready to spawn but do not, that's because you've not furnished them with the appropriate environmental cue. Unfortunately no one really knows what environmental cues trigger spawning in otos, but one thing which has triggered spawning in captivity is the presence of spawning Corydoras. You could try adding adults of some easily spawned cory and see if that'll help.
(Personally I suspect otos aren't triggered by corys in nature, but by their conspecifics. They typically move in huge schools, and probably synchronize their breeding. In captivity the schools are much smaller and the otos wont trigger eachother - but a cory spawning can work as a stand-in.)

That said, are you sure your otos are gravid?
A ripe female isn't just plump, being plump is normal for otos, no she positively balloons.

Also, unfortunately, dropsy and intestinal parasites can make otos look gravid when they are not.

[Bas Pels]

Actually, I have had Otocinclus which firtsly went well, and after a few weeks would get fatter, and fatter, and die

I never opened one to see whether the thickness was from eggs or, say, an infection, and never took any pics in order to determine the species

but I did loose 9 out of 10 to this problem. This was in 2004, if I remember correctly

[Mike_Noren]

Could be dropsy, they have fairly sensitive stomachs.
I wiped out my zebra oto colony by feeding them thawed bloodworms, they all one by one ballooned with tell-tale reddening near the anus. If it's dropsy death should follow fairly soon, within a week or so of "ballooning".

Incidentally that was my third most expensive aquarium screw-up ever.

[L number Banana]

Thanks everyone,
I never thought about parasites or dropsy but I'm hoping not. Here's some pics from my earlier thread about the same otos. http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =5&t=26299

They're bigger now but still behaving normally. The one that was in the bubble stream is on the zuchinni this morning. Spawning behavior was going on earlier with the male being the newer very small otos. There are four or five big bellied otos and maybe 10 normal ones. The others in the tank look normal so far but I'll keep an eye out and try to get a close-up picture of the belly area. No funny red spots that I can see.

I'll try adding the Cory's since I just gave away the last batch of babies so there's more room again.

Mike_Noren wrote:

Could be dropsy, they have fairly sensitive stomachs.
I wiped out my zebra oto colony by feeding them thawed bloodworms, they all one by one ballooned with tell-tale reddening near the anus. If it's dropsy death should follow fairly soon, within a week or so of "ballooning".

That might be a good sign for me because they've been big since around the May 11. I guess they would be gone by now if that was it. I'm crossing my fingers that frisky corys may do the job. Also, I trimmed back some of the larger plants so it's more open now. I think I'll put some back just in case that was one of the things that stopped the little wiggling-on-the-head dance.

Thanks

[apistomaster]

I agree with Mike that the concept of fish dying because they become egg bound is an old fish keeping myth.
Your fish is either actually ready to spawn if exposed to the right trigger or has developed dropsy for some reason. Healthy female Otocinclus do become quite full in appearance. Otocinclus gather in enormous schools in the wild consisting of 10's of thousands of fish. It is likely that they are a mass spawning fish which is probably why the aquarium spawning attempts usually fail and those that do happen tend to be incidental. In my few deliberate attempts to spawn the common Otocinclus I did see the typical Corydoras-like courtship behaviors but never induced any actual spawning.

Those darn Zebra Otos are delicate. It has not been my most expensive loss but I have not yet received any in good enough shape to even get them established well.

[L number Banana]

Thanks Larry,
I bought three more C.trillineatus tonight to go with the two I have from the first batch. Maybe they'll get frisky and help the otos get the right idea. I'm off Friday so maybe another big water change with rainwater too.

I agree with the zebra otos- $14.99 to order them here, sight unseen, worth it if they're in perfect health but I have yet to see any. I'll concentrate on getting my common batch happy first Pic are in the cam, will post them shortly just to make sure I'm looking at gravid fish and not something nasty. Behavior is still normal, even when the spiral val grass can no longer hold their weight and it bends down to the sand!

[nvcichlids]

Behavior is still normal, even when the spiral val grass can no longer hold their weight and it bends down to the sand!

Hehe, that is funny because my

Lasiancistrus heteracanthus

can sit on my jungle val without making it bend over.

[L number Banana]

L number Banana wrote: Behavior is still normal, even when the spiral val grass can no longer hold their weight and it bends down to the sand!


nvcichlids wrote:
Hehe, that is funny because my Lasiancistrus heteracanthus can sit on my jungle val without making it bend over.

I think I need some plant food! You've got some nice vals going there. Mine are certainly nice to look at but must be pretty wimpy.
Do yours spend a good part of their growing energy making new vals pop up all over the place? I could start a nursery
My last pics were too fuzzy but I'll try to get one of the oto sitting on one of the blades. She's almost visible on both sides - from the back of the blade Still only in the belly and still no signs of redness. Four new Corys added and BIG water change coming tomorrow.

[nvcichlids]

I bought these vals that were already at 2' in length, so they were very healthy. I only have a few "shoots" that have started to grow, but definately have 2 large healthy mother plants. I am debating pulling out the shoots and putting them in a 12" tall tank so the light is more intense.

BTW, you want to see nice plant, I have an anubias plant that used to fill 1/4 of a 33 gallon XL until I split it in half.

[L number Banana]

Finally some spawning activity is occurring!
The tiniest oto in the tank is getty frisky with three of the gigantic females. I have one unknown brownish oto and he hasn't gone near her. Maybe they can tell when it's not the right species?
I watched on and off most of the day and saw him shimmying up to the females all day but never in the T position It was always near the tail, off to the side, on top of her back...and finally a few minutes ago, he got it right. Don't see any eggs anywhere but all the very gravid females have a somewhat distended tiny tube-like thing I think, hard to get them to stay still long enough to really tell what I'm looking at.

Lost one very fat female last week - no signs of anything unusual After being that full of eggs for that long, I'm wondering if it was suicide. Not meaning to make light of it but I think it's been almost two months!!

Don't know if it has anything to do with it but as a last resort, I turned the temp down a couple degrees. Corys have been spawning all along and the farlowella are gravid too. The only change fish-wise is that I think my P. maccus may be gravid now. Need to find her a hubby.

[racoll]

You should be able to see if your oto is gravid or not. The yellow mass of eggs is quite visible just above the anal fin at the bottom of the abdomen.

[L number Banana]

Thanks Racoll,

The eggs have been somewhat visible for a-g-e-s, that's why I've been so worried. They look like little yellowish balls in the lower part of the huge belly. I shake too much to get a good photo though. I've tried several times and all have been fuzzy. Thought I got a pic of the t position today but too fuzzy as usual. Someday I'll have a camera with an image stabilizer Hopefully the activity I saw today will finally be the right time to release those eggs!
If they're skinnier soon, I'll feel as relieved as they will.

[L number Banana]

Had a ph crash, the otos have dropped ?? their eggs and look great, though still a bit bigger than the others.
Don't have a clue if any of them made it but I've got some sand on a leaf that's pretty high up maybe 6" from the sand. Could these be infertile oto eggs, tetra eggs or did some fish just manage to get some sand up there? I've read that oto eggs should be yellowy/orange. These are kind of clear.
Any ideas? They're miniscule compared to a regular cory egg. About the size of shrimp eggs. I tried to blow them off with the turkey baster and they are sticking but I didn't exactly blast the water at them.
Sand grains or eggs? Sorry this is the only non-fuzzy picture I could get. If it's sand, who transports sand?

[Silurus]

Looks like sand to me.

[L number Banana]

Oh phooey, it IS sand, I finally stuck my hand in and squished. It's very stuck to the leaf so now I have to figure what's putting sticky stuff on the leaf or is the leaf having issues. The other leaves on the same plant are nice and smooth - no goo at all.

Bent back every leaf in the tank and not one yellow/orange egg anywhere that I can find. A gazillion cory eggs though

Still have one gravid oto out of the bunch but at least I fixed the PH back to 6.5, no casualties except that the water is whitish again Back to square one.

Thanks and now I've truly mastered the dumb question.