ever see this pleco before

[hotplecogirl]

new pick ups.

[MatsP]

Hard to say from that photo exactly what they look like - a lateral view photo would be helpful (and for proper ID, a mouth-shot will help a whole lot).

--
Mats

[DutchFry]

Looks like some attractively patterned

Panaque changae

to me

indeed, a lateral view would be great.

[MatsP]

Certainly looks simiar to P. changae, and the colours are about right too. But I don't want to put a label on it until we see more of the fish.

--
Mats

[DutchFry]

agreed.

Panaque sp(l206)

could be another option (or pic 5 is actually P. changae?)

[hotplecogirl]

here is another picture.I think this is a fish you do not see often.

[hotplecogirl]

i do not think this is P. changae at all.

[MatsP]

I don't think so either. Where did they come from (at least what country, which river system would be even better to know).

--
Mats

[DutchFry]

well, on what grounds do you think it is not P. changae?

I'm quite sure this is a Panaque species, a pic of the mouth would confirm this.

I had a look through my Aqualog copy and Ingo's most recent book, and there are quite a few species of Panaque (or Panaqolus, if you prefer) with similar head patterns as these. the ones I could find are:

- P. changae
- P. sp. L206
- P. sp. L341
- P. sp. L397

Besides L397 which is from Brazil, they are all from Peru. I think these fishes are from Peru as well, but any information you have on capture location would be greatly appreciated. I don't think it's L397 because of the narrow stripes your fishes have (vs broad stripes in L397), L341 is darker in coloration (although this is not a good feature for identification, L397 is more reddish), L206 doesn't seem to fit the bill as well, as colors and pattern are wrong.

So this leaves P. changae as the best candidate. The only thing that throws me a bit is the caudal. your fishes seem to have nice filaments on the upper and lower caudal lobes, just like for example

Panaque sp`iquitos`

, and P. changae does not have this feature (at least not in the pics that are available to me right now).

please let me know why you think this is not P. changae, and if you can, please include a clear shot of the mouth.

[bronzefry]

It looks like P.changae. The river of origin always helps.
Amanda

[hotplecogirl]

collection point was Columbia.

[plec0]

well i looked thru the catelog and from my perspective its not an L-206 if you notice the 206 has spots on its tail. this sp has lines.. the L397 has a different shaped tail and although very similar, color is off plus the lines or stripes arent nearly as vivid as the 397's .. ,this IMO. i dont thinkits neither the 206 or 397. but i bet my money on it being some sort of panaque Sp. and a lovely one at that.. if you willing to sell them PM me please.

[bronzefry]

Panaque spp. often have tail filament extentions. One location to the next may vary. Creek X may have caudal fin filaments. Creek Y may not. Color should be the very last thing to look at with a fish. It is the most changable thing. Many other variables make a species. Dorsal fin ray count, distance of fins, odontodes, eye distances to various markers, snout length, etc. help determine what a species is or isn't. I don't care what it's name is-I'd love to come across them any day of the week!!
Amanda

[MatsP]

I personally disagree that colour is the "last thing to look at" - but I certainly agree that it's far from the ONLY thing to look at. But if there is (a significant) difference in colouration, I'd say it's not the same species - no matter how similar or dissimilar other features are. The reason scientists often discard the colouration is that they often have preserved specimens that have lost a large amount of their natural colour, and due to this have to rely on OTHER methods to determine species. This doesn't mean that we as hobbyists should ignore the most obvious of differences.

--
Mats

[hotplecogirl]

The five of them went into a heavily wooded 30 gallon tank by themselves.I hope some day to breed these.

[jimoo]

Hotplecogirl, did you pick these up locally? If so, where? I'm sure you got them all, just curious.

[hotplecogirl]

These came from a great friend that just got back into bringing in fish from Columbia and Brazil.I had the chance to buy a bunch but snoozed too long,almost didn't get these five.I do have xxxlarge L240 and xxxlarge L114's coming in at the end of the week if your interested.

[jimoo]

Thanks. I was just curious. Wondered if there was a store I was missing in my rounds. I actually have to break down my tank and get rid of all my fish for a major move soon (bye bye breeding sterbai). But again, thank you.

[hotplecogirl]

when you sell your fish drop me a pm,I would be interested in your stock.