Sexual dimorphism in Anaspidoras Macrostoma...

[yellowcat]

After a long search and interest in African catfish, in particular clarotidae varieties, especially anaspidoras and parauchenoglanis species, I finally found and had shipped to me several anaspidoras macrostoma (macrostomus). I soon noticed the morphological differences as well as distinct difference in color and markings between them. They came from Kinshasa, D.R. Congo. The one's with the more distinct vertical bars seem longer and thinner with smaller heads compared to the one's with the fine smaller spots, thicker body mass and larger heads and more stout appearance, considering that they just arrived. My question is which are the males and females. My guess is the fine spotted one's are the fem's but ? I will send Jools some better pic's for the Cat-eLog once they fatten up a bit...

[MatsP]

Anaspidoglanis macrostoma

There is sexing info in the above Cat-eLog link. Apparently, it's mainly a size difference.

--
Mats

[yellowcat]

Yes I saw that, male's may be smaller and darker, a bit vague perhaps. I've seen info and diagrams of parauchenoglanis species viewed from the above that show the opposite is true as far as comparing overall head and body shape minus the color/marking differences with the more robust specimens said to be females. As these are juveniles around 3" long, I suppose the differences will become more apparent as they grow...

[MatsP]

Yes, I have some that are about 5-6", and I can't say for sure if they are male or female. I've had one of them a lot longer than the other two, so that one is bigger - unfortunately, doesn't mean the other two are male or female...

I've also never heard of anyone breeding these fish - and they are SUPPOSED to be territorial, but mine don't mind each other too much - they aren't exactly cuddling up to each other, but they aren't chasing each other the way some territorial fish can do.

--
Mats

[jippo]

The spotted one is Parauchenoglanis sp. Look at their eyes, genus Anaspidoglanis the eye is without free border and it is covered by transparent skin, with Parauchenoglanis this is opposite.

At the moment there are four species from genus Parauchenoglanis that are found from Congo area. These are P.balayi, P.altipinnis, P.punctatus and P.ngamensis.

I would say it is P.punctatus but I would like to see more close up picture of it.

[yellowcat]

Oh my, I hope you're right! I've been searching for months for parauchenoglanis. What are the odds, I got 2 shipments of fish, one batch of 12 and approx half were the one variety and the other different and I kept 6, a mix of both kinds. Then I got 2 from another importer and received one of each pattern in that shipment. I assumed it was wishful thinking to be getting 2 sought after species. I arrived at the conclusion that the difference must be in the sexes. I've since noticed that even among the same variety some are long/slim and others more stout. Here are 3 pic's, two of the suspected parauchenoglanis including an eye closeup and another of one of the 'stout' anispidoras. From looking back at the Cat-eLog I noticed that my smallest of the spotty one's looks exactly like the juvenile p. guttus shown there...

[yellowcat]

Here's 3 more pic's for comparison. If indeed they are different species then wouldn't that be something like the holy grail find in fishkeeping for those seeking the rare and obscure? In any case, these are a new and interesting species for me, very attractive and cuter than baby warthogs!

anaspidoglanis...

another parauchenoglanis?

parauchenoglanis?

[MatsP]

It is indeed a good find. I wouldn't necessarily call it "holy grail".

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Mats

[Birger]

It would be just great if you could keep a good photo record of the different ones that you have, and eventually submit them.

birger

[sidguppy]

I've also never heard of anyone breeding these fish - and they are SUPPOSED to be territorial, but mine don't mind each other too much - they aren't exactly cuddling up to each other, but they aren't chasing each other the way some territorial fish can do.

hate to spoil the beans, but Mats, you've been keeping 3 of these -size 5-7"- in a tiny tank; just barely 50 cm....with only a few hiding places and some Mystus in there as well.

that's not only way too small; it can be compared to the fish being in a shop.
as we all know, fish do NOT show their proper behviour in shops.
it's 'dampened'; I don't know how to say it properly. but a large portion of their behaviour ill be missing.

this is also a well-known trick of cichlidkeepers that keepers of Mbuna or Simochromis or Tropheus use. overstock the fish in a bare small tank.
they will eat and grow and maybe spawn but they won't show their true behaviour.

a catfish-example: we have seen in London in one of the shops a group of juvenile Hemibagrus spp. all huddled together.
this wouldnt hppen if you put the same group in a larger home tank with some furniture: that group would start their true behaviour and within days they would have ripped each other to shreds.

if you'd put the 3 Parauchenoglanis in a 5 foot tank with adequate sand, lots of wood and stones etc; they sure will sow a lot more character.

I've slept next to that tank and at night they would fight and I could hear the terracotta hiding places rattle against the windows.

you really shouldn't make statements about the behaviour of any fish if it isn't kept properly.
fish kept like they are in a shop are not representative of fish kept in a proper set up.

[Bas Pels]

you really shouldn't make statements about the behaviour of any fish if it isn't kept properly.

Personally, I think all statements about behaviour should refer to the tank, tankmates and group size bevore going into the behaviour itself

I've seen far too often how the addition of a few fishes, how redocrating or moving them into a larger or smaller tanks influences behaviour

Just a cich lid example? Last week I moved a pair of 'Cichlasoma' urothalmus from a 9 feet tank to my other 9 feet tank, but in stead of meeting 5 large Vieja, 2 Petenis @ 20 cm and 1 female Parachromis motaguensis, now they meet a pair of Vieja bifasciatus and 6 Astatheros robertsoni.

The result? For the first time in 2 years eggs

Same fish, same size tank, but other tankmates

[yellowcat]

Very interesting comments everyone, thanks! Perhaps I overstated the 'holy grail' comment a bit, for some that would be a blue-eyed pl*co at Wal-Mart for $1.99, for me a pseudopimelodus mangurus at my LFS... I once found what I thought was a rare pseudopimelodus species in the oddball tank at the LFS, turned out to be an very rare Indian Rita Gogra, never saw one available anywhere before or since. I will be keeping a photo log of their progress as I do with all my fish and monitoring their behaviours among themselves as well as between the species and sexes as they grow and establish territories between two tanks. One tank is a 60G. bowfront with lots of bogwood, a flowerpot and a cave, the other, for the smallest specimens is a 15G. tank with abundant bogwood furniture. As far as breeding goes, a forum search here revealed an accidental spawning of a. macrostoma by one member back in 2003 with living fry as a result but no clue as to what triggered the event. I.D. among these species likely varies by virtue of location to some degree, an example is other clarotid's like a. occidentalis, morphology, color and patterns vary widely depending on what river system they come from. Still welcoming any positive I.D.'s on the suspect parauchenoglanis or educated guesses....

[MatsP]

I've also never heard of anyone breeding these fish - and they are SUPPOSED to be territorial, but mine don't mind each other too much - they aren't exactly cuddling up to each other, but they aren't chasing each other the way some territorial fish can do.

hate to spoil the beans, but Mats, you've been keeping 3 of these -size 5-7"- in a tiny tank; just barely 50 cm....with only a few hiding places and some Mystus in there as well.

You'll be happy to hear that he Anaspidoglanis macrostoma are now enjoying 50% more floor space, 20% taller and no Mystus cohabitants. Time will tell if they show different behaviour.

--
Mats

[sidguppy]

that's good news!
I always have had a soft spot for these, although they're hard to get these days

but they were never common in the Dutch trade
sometimers a tank full, then a 10 year absence.

the only "staple" riverine Claroteid is the huge Auchenoglanis occidentalis. other stuff ranges from quite rare to once in a lifetime.

my 2 Parauchenoglanis spp behave like Auchenipterids; they even give the Rhinodoras downstairs a run for the money. they have a 300L tank all of their own (the only fish with them are 4 Ancistrus), but they don't show ever.
they're gonna move downstairs soon and there it's either you show up for food or you'll end up thinner ;)

[MatsP]

Prior to todays move, mine would come out to eat whole Novo Tabs. They are in a 180 liter tank, so about 70% more water than their old home (which is a tad bigger than you described, but clearly not big enough for the group).

--
Mats

[yellowcat]

Jippo was right! The differences had nothing to do with sexual dimorphism, they're separate genus and species. I do see differences in morphology among the anaspidoglanis macrostoma and think I have 2 males and one female. I did find out that the a. macrostoma need to be kept alone as they will fight and nip fins of their conspecifics. They also grow faster than the parauchenoglanis species and both species are not tolerant of temp's over 80F and ph higher than 8.0 I think the parauchenoglanis species is p. guttatus, which according to FishBase also exists in the Congo River system. Here's a pic of my now favorite fish in it's stunning nocturnal coloration as opposed to it's daytime coloration when it turns a darker brown...

[Birger]

That is a good looking fish and some good insight

Birger

[jippo]

I did find out that the a. macrostoma need to be kept alone as they will fight and nip fins of their conspecifics.

I have kept several A. macrostoma and Parauchenoglanis sp. at the same tank(720l) without any trouble. In fact many times there was 2-3 species at same pipe. I still have few macrostoma and only "action" I can see between them is when males are chasing very fat female.

I think the parauchenoglanis species is p. guttatus, which according to FishBase also exists in the Congo River system.

This is from Revision of genus Parauchenoglanis: This species is present from the Ouémé River in Benin to the Sanaga River in Cameroon. It is never found far inland(maximal distance from coast approximately 120km

I'm still guessing you have P. punctatus.

[MatsP]

Is it possible that:
1. There are two different variants of A. macrostoma.
or
2. If there are multiple males in a tank, they fight.

I admit mine were in a fairly small tank (and lately with some mystus), but in the few days after the move, they still are perfectly happy together - this morning I had two in the same cave.

So perhaps I have no males?

--
Mats

[yellowcat]

At one point I had 3 a. macrostoma in one 60G (US) tank, 1 female (the most robust) and 2 males I think. One or both beat up and killed one male. Of the remaining two, the female was attacking and nipping the fins and tail of the male. I removed the male to a community tank and it's now healed and doing fine. In another tank I have an a. macrostoma (male?) with the parauchenoglanis sp. and they get along quite nicely. Hopefully more keepers of parauchenoglanis will provide photo's to the Cat-Log to help further identify these rare and obscure species that so closely resemble one another. I plan to obtain more examples of the genus if and when they become available but imports are very uncommon to the U.S. and apparently elsewhere as well. Being aware that Dr. Tom Geerinickx has done a systematic revision of the genus I will seek out a copy of the paper which hopefully will provide at least drawings of the various species among the expected measurements, verbal descriptions and preserved specimen photo's to help further identify these fish...

[jippo]

Being aware that Dr. Tom Geerinickx has done a systematic revision of the genus I will seek out a copy of the paper which hopefully will provide at least drawings of the various species among the expected measurements, verbal descriptions and preserved specimen photo's to help further identify these fish...

PM me your email address and I send you that revision.

[yellowcat]

Thanks Jippo! After an hour or so of attempting to send you a PM you either got a dozen messages or none? Probably the latter... Something isn't working for me and not sure why? I would love a copy of the paper in question you have so kindy offered to send me! I just added my e-mail address to my User Profile space if that helps. Failing that I'll send an e-mail to Jools to forward to you and somehow get back in touch. I very much appreciate your input and efforts on this subject...

[MatsP]

If you haven't sent Jools an e-mail yet, send one to me. Jools is quite busy, and I'm sure I'm as capable of forwarding an e-mail address... ;)

--
Mats

[yellowcat]

Thanks all, tried another way and P.M.'s successfully sent....

[yellowcat]

More on Parauchenoglanis I.D..... With thanks to Jippo for sending me 'A Revision of the African Genus Parauchenoglanis', after a few readings, I am now better able to attempt to identify the species in question. Of all the possible parauchenoglanis species it could be, based upon general morphology by a process of elimination, it is narrowed down to three, p. punctatus, p. guttatus and p. ngamensis. Although p. guttatus and p. ngamensis share more physical characteristics than the other species such as markings, pectoral spine serration's, very similar fin ray count and caudal fin proportions among others, based on geographical distribution, p. guttatus can be eliminated as it is found only in African coastal river systems and not in the Congo Basin. Although these fish were exported from Kinshasa, D.R. Congo it's only a partial clue to collection point. P. punctatus and p. ngamensis both exist in the Congo Basin but since p. punctatus is part of one defined group that has mandibular barbels that extend beyond the tip of the pectoral spine and p. ngamensis is part of another group with shorter barbel length, p. punctatus can be eliminated. Since p. ngamensis exist in the Kasai River system, a tributary of the Congo, this further narrows possibilities. Briefly, based on such characteristics such as colour/markings, in this case 5 rows of vertical interconnected black dots on a background that varies from light to dark, caudal fin proportions higher than long and shape from flat to round as in this case and short mandibular barbels that barely extend the base of the pectoral spine. In addition, the close proximity between the adipose fin and caudal fin and from a frozen specimen, a mildly serrated anterior and coarsely serrated posterior margins of the pectoral spine combined with a dorsal fin ray count of 7, pectoral fin rays 6, anal fin rays 6, all are factors that seem to point to the conclusion that this may very well be p. ngamensis... Here's two more photo's in the darker daytime colours and brighter nocturnal one's....

[jippo]

I agree with P.ngamensis. You have done a great work to solve this species .

[Birger]

What is the size of them now?

And, how long since you have been able to tell males from females?

Birger

[yellowcat]

The a. macrostoma are around 4", the parauchenoglanis about 3" Sexing the anaspidoglanis is admittedly guesswork on my part as I'm assuming the slimmer shaped one's being males, the more stout or robust being female, no science involved...