New Mini monsters on the feed.

[Redtailrob]

My recent purchase of x 2 P.Lutkeni/Jau /Zungaro Zungaro seem to have settled in very quickly.
Although still completely out of sight by day I watched them in the dark last night actively hunting for food & taking small Earthworms already .
Both very fat this morning- Excellent.

[Stackdeck]

You probably know this , but watch for aggresion! They got a few here in SG a month back but decided against it after reading the C-O-M article.

[Viktor Jarikov]

You mean towards each other?

My 5" Zeezee spent a lot of time with 25 other types of cats in a 150 gal. Got along just fine with fishes smaller and bigger than him.

[Redtailrob]

I had been pre warned that they where showing aggression towards each other & they where being kept separate from EACH OTHER in the shop. Loads of other cats & fishes in with them though.
Both mine are kept with other fish, just not in the same tanks as each other.
Showing no sign of aggression thus far, but Im keeping my eyes peeled.
Viktor you still got yours? Any pics?

[Viktor Jarikov]

Very sadly, no Rob. I lost him during one of the drives to FL due to my stupid overly confidence. We hit a late-in-the-season (April) cold spell in New York-Pennsylvania-West Virginia with snow and freezing rain on the first 15-20 h of the trip. The water temp dropped too much too fast.

God willing, I will try again.

[arapaimag]

I have not had a lot of experience as most of you have had with Zungaro (Paulicea) zungaro (lutkeni).

However I have found the fishes personality and the size of the tank to be a defining influence in their behaviour.

I only have owned them over a 10 year period and never owned a large adult.

My largest was only 15"/38.1CM TL when I purchased him and he died at 41"/104CM TL several years later of unknown causes.

When I first got mine I quarantined him in a 180G/681L for 2 months. After quarantine I placed him in a 225G/851L with a 21"/53.3CM TL Hypostomus plecostomus and a 22"/55.9CM TL Oxyelotris marmorata.

The first night he killed the O. marmorata and the second night the H. plecostomus. Both dead fish were measured after their deaths. I then kept him in that tank till he reached 24"/61CM TL. His personality suggested he might harm my rays or even my Hemibagrus (Mystus) wyckii in my 15kG/56,781L so I choose to put him in my big tank instead.

In the big tank he was a completely different fish.

My Wallago leerii female rules the tank and he fell in line and never bothered any of my other catfish and only ate cichlids that fit in his mouth and large quantities of mackerel/herring/trout/smelts and salmon. I never once saw him engage another fish in quarrel. If he killed any plecos I never saw it happen. But with several tons of rock in the tank they do have lots of shelter.

I do still have a young Zungaro (Paulicea) zungaro (lutkeni) and am raising him in appropriate sized aquariums till he is big enough to go into one of my larger tanks.

[Viktor Jarikov]

Michael, you are way too modest. My experience, for instance, stands next to yours like a pebble next to a mountain. Every time I read your accounts, I feel edified.

So 41" is not a large adult? I know this is not max but it is pretty large.

Wow: Shocking; neither sleeper goby nor pleco are easy fish to even injure, not to say kill. Could you make out how he killed them?

For clarity to all: Arapaimag's "big" tank is a bit over 50,000 US gal. 2nd big is 15,000 US gal.

[arapaimag]

The fish appeared to be killed by a constant battering.

Viktor you are an incredible hobbyist. Your passion for catfish places you in an elite group amongst the a select few even on this excellent forum.

I enjoy and keep records of all my fish but I spread myself over the entire hobby of fresh water fish and equally love many other families of fish as well as the catfish. Thus will never learn as much about catfish as you do.

I have followed your well detailed threads and was and am impressed by your never say die attitude in providing your pets with as large a volume of water as your house could hold. Many people know the requirements of tank size needed for their large catfish but few are like you to actually change your life to provide the appropriate living conditions for them. The number of species you accumulated while living in Rochester was amazing.

Now you have turned your life around again by moving and purchasing several acres of land in Florida to give your fish the large volume tanks/ponds that I can only dream about.

I wish you nothing but success.

[Viktor Jarikov]

Thanks much, Michael, your own modesty, apparently, is only matched by your generousity. Means a lot to me albeit I know for sure I will never live up to the descriptions and expectations you are setting up; so, please, allow me to remain at my own, lowly opinion of myself.

Anyway, back to Z. z., Rob, how are the little guys? What did you think of Arapaimag's interesting observation?

Care to post a photo?

[Redtailrob]

Amazing Posts & comments gents, thanks for contributing.
I can only dream of having setups of the likes that you two have managed, but Im getting there.

Some very interesting points Arapaimag/Viktor.
I think the same came be said of a large majority of not just cats but most fish species in that they will act differently in accordance to their environment.
Especially with regards to lowered aggresion in relation to tank space.
I've kept several species of fish over that years that in one setup will be super aggressive only in another to be fine.
The H.Filamentus I kept years ago would be a perfect example - took it of the shop for free because they just couldnt house it with anything, placed it in my 500G Pond with some bigger Cats (20"-28") & it was super placid!
I would imagine that Arapaimag's Jau met its demise at the jaws of one of the Leerii perhaps? Would be difficult I guess to keep a close eye on certain fish that hide in such a large setup and also I would assume most of the aggression or territorial disputes to be during the hours of darkness.
From my own experience - my cats kept in the heated ponds are much harder to keep a close eye on than my Cats in large full frontal glass aquaria and have to be carefully observed during feeding - hand feeding is not only great fun but essential for viewing/observation
As for my mini beauties, they're doing great.
Proving to be very nocturnal & Hide all day but will shoot out and back again to grab Earthworms placed in the aquaria.
Will see what i can do with regards to pictures as short of taking them out, pictures will be night time shots which aren't going to make great viewing Im afraid

[Viktor Jarikov]

I would imagine that Arapaimag's Jau met its demise at the jaws of one of the Leerii perhaps?

and he died at 41"/104CM TL several years later of unknown causes.

Michael would know, I think. Even simple regular stress of badgering leads to some sort of observable deseases. Battle/bite wounds would have been even more obvious.

[Redtailrob]

Hi Viktor

I was going by Arapaimag's comment "The fish appeared to be killed by a constant battering" but relize on re-reading the post that he was talking about the pleco & sleeper Goby, my mistake.
I was only assuming it COULDVE been the leerii based on Arapaimags on comments but yes probably unknown causes.
Wow what a specimen @ 41 "

[Redtailrob]

Hi all.

Pictured attached as requested.
Taken in the dark this morning, managed to catch him out on the prowl
R

[Buddiechrist]

Nice guys, I've had one a few months now, awesome night time hunter, but be careful as they can get territorial and they are cannibalistic I had three and now I have one super large 7 incher.

[Redtailrob]

Thanks for your post Buddiechrist.
Yeap aware of their behaviour & tendencies.
Mine are kept in seperate Tanks and with other Cats considerabley bigger than themselves.
So pleased i have these, just dont get to see them unless I sit in the dark
They will occasionally shoot out & grab worms etc before dashing back into the nearest cave.

[Viktor Jarikov]

sweet little button... mine would be a hider too but with just some plastic plants here and there he sat on the bottom in between them and was always visible, more or less; voracious eater but did not bother a smaller wyckii and slightly longer leerii housed with him in a 27 gal hex along with two surinam pipas and a few african clawed frogs...

[Redtailrob]

Haven't witnessed any agreesion from either on them yet.
Although Im sure they would be aggressive towards each other if housed together.
Need plenty of caves in one of their tanks as the Dam Pleco is an aggresive sod & chases everything
This one pictured absolutely hogged out last night on defrosted Prawns, he looks like he's swallowed a golf ball this morning, ridiculous!