Plec ID?

philtre · Post by **philtre** » 29 Dec 2003, 06:50

Hi all,

Came across one un-IDed fella over the weekend. Saw the fella at a LFS. looks like a giant oto with TL about 100mm. Head not very flat, overall dark body colouration. dark brown body with dull red markings. Seems like lines on the top of the head but spotted along the body. Body spots about 2-3mm. Thick spots as with markings, not fine lines nor spots. caudal fin clamped when I saw it, cant figure out if it's marked. (don't quite look like a hypoptopoma, head too flat)

In the afternoon, saw the fish again at another location. However this fish has been with the owner for a few years already i.e. not same shipment. But looking at markings and shape, suspect to be same species. This specimen is about 120mm-130mm TL grew from about 70mm or so (estimated)

I know this is a shot in the dark, but it's bugging the heck out of me.

would appreciate if anyone could point me in the right direction. Sorry I don't have any pictures, left the cam at home over the weekend.

Appreciate any comments.

Thanks very much in advance
phil

OH PS! the fish's kinda stocky . kinda like overall stocky. erm....

Post by **Silurus** » 29 Dec 2003, 23:17

I happen to be in Singapore for a short while. PM or email me the location of the LFS and I might go check it out for you.

philtre · Post by **philtre** » 04 Jan 2004, 08:24

Hi Silurus,

Thanks very much for the attempt to ID the fella. We managed a picture of the fella ... and I think the dorsal ray count was 6 if I'm not wrong. Probably slightly over 3" in TL

Here's the fella

Taken from my gallery

Thanks very much in advance!
phil

Post by **Silurus** » 04 Jan 2004, 14:35

I think it's some kind of juvenile Hypostomus.

pleco_breeder · Post by **pleco_breeder** » 04 Jan 2004, 15:12

Hello,

HH is not somebody that I want to disagree with regarding an ID.

However, I believe that I can see the telltale dentintion of a Panaque in the reflection. Any chance of getting a pic of the mouth?

Larry Vires

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 05 Jan 2004, 13:21

Or a Hypostomus (previously in Cochliodon) therefore it could have the old spoon teeth.

My guess however would be a bola pleco, the one known as ?

Jools

Achim · Post by **Achim** » 05 Jan 2004, 13:59

Hi,

i have too agree with Jools, the body form looks like a Sophiancistrus. Also the dentition would fit, if my memory is right.

Achim

Erwin · Post by **Erwin** » 05 Jan 2004, 14:30

Couldn't it be that this one is a L174? A bit more light on its sides, and it could fit in shape and pattern.

ERwin

Yann · Post by **Yann** » 05 Jan 2004, 19:12

HI Erwin!

Isn't this fish a bit to high to be a L174.
The eyes are a bit to big
The adipose fins is too small
The dorsal fins should be almost touching the adipose fins when it is close...
I would agree with Jools on that one
Cheers
Yann

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 05 Jan 2004, 23:20

Achim wrote:i have too agree with Jools, the body form looks like a Sophiancistrus. Also the dentition would fit, if my memory is right.

My first thought from the description was a Bola Plec, and although the colour in the picture looks slightly atypical I still think it is.

Erwin · Post by **Erwin** » 06 Jan 2004, 10:06

All right, let's compare pictures of both (L146/L174) right under each other:

I think, the shorter head in both L174 and of the fish in the picture what need to be compared, is about he same. The bola-plеco owns a longer snout, and more striking a "face" that always looks like you have insulted him. This impression is giving from the characteristic thin ocular diverticulum. You will notice, that it is broad in the orig. picture (I'm not talking about its elongation, because that depends on how much light bothers the fish). And looking at the second specimen of L146, you will notice, that the dots are more tightly set, even if you compare it to another specimen of L174, that also owns mor tightly set dots.

What do you think?

Erwin

philtre · Post by **philtre** » 06 Jan 2004, 12:40

hmmm... it does look kinda like the 174. will try and get more pics this week.

any tips on what to look out for or pic angles that I could attempt to get?

Thanks again people!

Cheers,
phil

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 06 Jan 2004, 13:17

Erwin,

I know what you're saying and I agree with your points but I think the angle of the original photo combined with the fact it is a very young fish have thrown you off the scent? Not all photographs are as clear and perfectly positioned as yours.

L174 always has a white (sometimes nearly pink) background colouration, I do not see this on the fish in question - the fin barring particularly in the caudal (as we cannot see the other fins) also seems to be more like L146.

But surely shape is better for ID than colour, so your points would seem stronger than mine?

I would suggest that these two l-numbers look very similar in terms of shape (but not really colour) as young fish (say 3cm) and the differences are more noticable with age?

A picture of the teeth may clear this up as L174 is a Hypancistrus but maybe the fish in question is too young for this to be useful? Also, philtre, perhaps you could find out if this fish came from Brazil or Peru? How big is the fish? Can we have a photo with its fins erect?

Jools

Erwin · Post by **Erwin** » 06 Jan 2004, 18:37

You're right Jools. Sometimes its so easy: Phil, if you can get a look into the mouth of one of the fish, you should be able to see the differences.

Here are the pictures:

on the left hand side, the bola-plеco, on the right L174 with very few teeth in the lower jaw.

Erwin

philtre · Post by **philtre** » 11 Jan 2004, 07:26

ok ... here are some of the pics I have taken yesterday.

Hope one of this would be helpful after all.

Thanks All!

Cheers,
phil

PS: you could go into my gallery to look at the bigger pictures

Sorry about the watermark

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 12 Jan 2004, 09:26

Well, I don't think it's a Hypancistrus, so I will stick with my opinion.

Jools

Erwin · Post by **Erwin** » 12 Jan 2004, 10:23

I agree now, it's not a Hypancistrus. The new pictures also show a much longer snout, as it could be seen from the first one. Yes, it could be a L146. But Phil, don't buy this specimen. It's damages in the fins won't heal back, even the adipose fin hast lost its spine.

Erwin

philtre · Post by **philtre** » 12 Jan 2004, 17:26

Hi All,

thanks very much for looking at the pictures, so I suppose this fella is a L146?

Erwin,
yeah, notice the dorsal fin spine as well as the caudal fin. Well, I'm just glad to get an ID of this fella!