Are my L204 sexually confused or is this mating behaviour?

[Jobro]

For about more than a week my L204 keep me guessing...

Out of the five L204 I have (2m, 2f, 1 unknown), two keep doing the weirdest things.

Usually it's pretty basic: the males sit in their caves, the females stay away from caves.

But lately it changed. The male leaves his cave and sits in front of it, while the female takes over the cave. He would not fight her off. He gives it away freely. Sometimes she stays in there for a whole day, with the male sitting somewhere close by. Mostly he sits right atop or in front of the cave. But he is not trying to enter the cave. Every now and then they swap positions and it goes the other way round, with the male caving and the female waiting in front or atop.

Sometimes they will do the "tender games" with their caudals, that Janne Ekström described here.

There seems to be no trapping or aggression at all. They are very gentle with each other. I am just so confused by the fact, that the male will not follow the female into his cave, like other plecos usually do.

Is this actually mating? Or are they just confused? xD
I was hoping to get a spawn after the first days of this behavior... but nothing seems to happen I think about removing the male to give the other male a go, since this female seems to be pretty willingly to me. But I am afraid that I might end up destroying the good vibes.

I will try to get some pictures and or videos up for you folks.

On a side note:
I kept them on very soft (100ms) and quite acidic (around PH 5.5) water for a very long time (about 1/2 year). Then I went for a single big water-change with hard (600ms) and a alkaline (PH water. After one week in that hard water, I started daily water-changes with very soft water for about 5 days and left them without further water-changes for 3 weeks now. This behavior started about 1.5 weeks after the daily water-changes stopped. Water-level went down quite a bit in the meantime.

[MarcW]

My L260 have been doing a similar thing for several months, the male leaves his cave and the very gravid female goes in, then the male spends up to 24 hours just sitting under some wood nearby. Then when I look again, the male is back in his cave, and the female has returned to hers!

I'm not sure why they do this, but I'm glad to hear they aren't the only fish doing it! They have spawned before, so I would have thought they would know what to do, but it seems the male hasn't been in the mood for several months!

Maybe you could try directing some current towards the cave, maybe the male doesn't see it as a suitable breeding location?

Hopefully they will spawn for you soon, good luck!

[Jobro]

Thank you Marc, I never saw something like this for any of my other plecos, so I was really not sure what's going on there.

Try 30% waterchange every day or every second day for some time, L260 should start reproducing then. Here is one of my juvies for you to look forward to them, they are so cute!

When I just went to check on my L204, there was actually no one in the cave.. they were both just sitting around... this is so strange, since my L204 males usually don't leave their caves, especially not during daytime.

a little later, the female reclaimed the cave:

the powerhead might be an option for me to try... need to pick it with caution, as the sand might go missing if I overdo it

[bekateen]

How big are your L204? They look small to me. Maybe they're too young or too immature to spawn?

My mustard spots are big. They're showing real trapping and courtship. But still no spawns yet.

Best of luck to you and your L204!

Cheers, Eric

[MarcW]

Thanks Jobro, I'll give the more frequent water changes a go, to see if it sets them off.

Good luck with your L204!

[Jobro]

How big are your L204? They look small to me. Maybe they're too young or too immature to spawn?

My mustard spots are big. They're showing real trapping and courtship. But still no spawns yet.

Best of luck to you and your L204!

Cheers, Eric

I had this male for over 2.5 years. Got them wild caught with about 4cm. Now they are 12-13cm TL. The males kinda stopped growing when they started caving. Even my smaller female has outgrown them by now. The bigger female (I bought her just this year, don't know the age) is about 15cm TL. She is a massive fish. So you are right, the male looks quite small in comparison. But they have been caving for at least one year now and looking at these spiky bodies, I was pretty sure they are ready to go.

The cave has a diameter of almost 5cm and the female fills it up pretty nicely. The male on the other side looks a little lost in there. But he chose this one over other sizes.

The male switched back in again, btw
Take a good look at his skin, the whole body is covered with odontodes.

[bekateen]

Okay thanks. Your fish may be too small. If they are 12-15cm TL, that should be about 8-12cm SL. The largest fish are probably ready, but I'd be surprised if the smallest are (although I also expect you have a better chance with small males than with small females).

Also, try narrower and deeper caves if you don't already have them in the tank. My 12-13cm SL mustard spots barely fit in their prefered cave, which is about 4cm outer diameter; the opening is about 2.5-3cm diameter. Their prefered cave is also long, about 15-18cm deep.

My mustard spots enter wider caves (5cm diameter) and shallower caves (10-13cm deep), but they never trap in them.

Cheers, Eric

[Jobro]

Thanks Eric, there are narrower caves, but he chose this one. Not sure if the female would fit into caves that are much narrower.

I have a similiar problem with my L134, the females are bigger and by far wider than the males. The males always sit in caves in which the females hardly fit. But when they breed, the males would always switch into a different, bigger cave, so that the females fit. I feel that this is the same reason why this male picked a bigger cave. The other male is inhabiting a narrower cave, but no female gives a damn about him

Anyhow, I placed a little narrower cave right next to that one and added a pump with a venturinozzle for more water movement and aeriation in that corner. Hopefully something interesting happens