New Auchenipterids

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 25 Mar 2006, 12:18

This post is just to inform you that I was able to obtain some new Auchenipterids. Moreover, they are species that I've never had before. They are:
- one Trachycorystes trachycorystes, which is pretty huge (27 cm). I truly hope it will behave....
- a pair of Trachelyopterus fisheri (pair meaning male & female).
What I didn't bring along was the fish I was actually most interested in: Ageneiosus polystictus. I just didn't dare because of its size.
Will be continued.

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 25 Mar 2006, 12:38

I have some intial pictures of these fish from Marc and will clean them up and post them soon.

Jools

Deb · Post by **Deb** » 25 Mar 2006, 13:19

Congratulations, Marc!

This is good news.
I can't wait to see the photos, especially T. trachycorystes.
Deborah

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 25 Mar 2006, 13:35

Jools, I know I should learn how to do this (edit & post pictures) myself. Until then, thanks for helping me out and sorry for the extra work.
Deb, thanks for your kind comment. I have been very excited the last few days, perhaps a bit too much and now I just feel pretty exhausted. Besides, what is this black monster going to do tonight?? I think the real joy will come tomorrow - that is, if nothing happens

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 25 Mar 2006, 18:27

The battle over the giant piece of wood has been won by the Trachycorystes; the Liosomadoras had very little chance.
There was a lot of agression involved, which didn't make me feel very comfortable with regard to the oncoming night....
I've also decided to get the Platystacus out; they'll be sitting ducks imo.

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 26 Mar 2006, 20:48

I was the proud ownwer of one Trachycorystes trachycorystes.
Hence the past tense. What I have seen last night - and kept me out of my sleep - matches nothing I've ever seen in my tanks. What I saw was a 27 cm long she-devil that tried to eat cq. bite everything that dared to move

.
I've asked Amiidae how his T.t. behaved beforehand. He wrote: I have a gentle specimen, that goes on well with another similar sized cat. All my other cats are smaller. Was I hoping this one would be gentle as well? I was.
Was it wise to buy this animal? No, certainly not!
Results: several fish have severe bite wounds, a few Exodons are missing (understatement) and all fishes are highly stressed. Well done, Marc! Just a few weeks after the Leporacanthicus debacle, let's create another one.
I felt terribly bad about this. But yet I had to tease them once more: I had to get this one out a.s.a.p.
So I called the LFS, which happens to be open every last Sunday of the month (lucky me!) and asked if I could return the fish. That was no problem at all. Moreover, I got a full refund and they were - like me - very sorry things turned out this way.
Did I learn anything from this painful event? Yes. Although I'm very fond of Auchenipterids, I've learned that I can't keep them all due to my restricted tank space. Also that I will no longer put the lives of my present fish at stake by buying fish that may be harmful to them.
To anyone interested in T.t.: think twice before purchase and make sure you can house it properly. Avoid the mistakes I made

Deb · Post by **Deb** » 27 Mar 2006, 00:34

Marc, I'm sorry to hear this bad news!

I hope your injured fish heal soon, and things return to normal.

Do you think that trachys should have their own, separate tank? What would be the minimum tank size for one? Your specimen was 27cm, or about 10 1/2", which is almost full size. Are they ever offered for sale as babies?

Deborah

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 27 Mar 2006, 19:08

Hi Deborah,
Yes I think Trachycorystes is at its best in a species tank or, as Amiidae said, in a tank with similar sized or even larger fish. This tank shouldn't be small; like all Auchenipterids it needs space to roam around at night.
I've never seen them offered as babies, and in answer to your PM-question I don't think this would make any difference. Sooner or later this fish will display its ferocious behaviour. It would be utopian to think that a tank raised Trachycorystes would behave differently from a wild caught specimen. Until yesterday I was pretty convinced that it would not attack other Auchenipterids. I can only think of one reason why I thought so: because it was convenient to me.....
There are two pictures of the animal, although I don't know if they already are in the Cat-eLog. Check the updates/new species list on the homepage.
Let me make clear that imo this is still a magnificent fish, but in this case the looks match the character.
I've had few fish that scared me, but this is definitely one.
Thanks for your good wishes on behalf of my fish. To end this post I would like to say that I'm still very pleased with my new Trachelyopterus fisheri. I do hope they're also pleased with me

Deb · Post by **Deb** » 27 Mar 2006, 20:07

Marc, I guess you've learned a lot from this, and so have all of us who have read your story. I did wonder if a smaller, younger fish would have been "tamer," but I think not from what you've said.

It's funny, in the close up of T.t. she's smiling. They always look like they're smiling! I still want one, and if I get the chance to buy one I'll set up a 55 (do you think that would be okay?) and just have a single specimen. I wonder if they try to attack their owners during tank cleaning, for example?

BTW, your close-up of the T.t. shows an excellent, crisply outlined view of the rugose cranial shield. Jools has added both shots to the Cat-e-log.

Good luck with your Trachelyopterus fisheri. They are beautiful.

Deborah

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 27 Mar 2006, 22:03

deb wrote: They always look like they're smiling!

Yes, and I think I know why: because of the dumbfounded faces of their owners when that mouth opens. It's huge!

deb wrote:
I still want one, and if I get the chance to buy one I'll set up a 55 (do you think that would be okay?) and just have a single specimen.

That depends on the size of that fish. A rather small specimen should do nicely in a 55. Perhaps you could contact Waldo about it?

deb wrote:
I wonder if they try to attack their owners during tank cleaning, for example?

I wouldn't get near those jaws. In order to get the fish out of a piece of wood, I used a wooden salad fork (I know, it's pretty uncommon) so I could lift the head. It bit the fork and wouldn't let go. As I didn't want to damage the fish and thus couldn't use much strenght, the fork was only released after the Trachy had been out of the water for some time and had to open its mouth....I've never seen anything like it.

deb wrote: BTW, your close-up of the T.t. shows an excellent, crisply outlined view of the rugose cranial shield

I knew this would make you happy

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 13 Sep 2006, 22:39

My trachy is vaery peacefull. He is about 8" and lives with three liosmodoras and three ornate pims, some uaru, geophagus angels and colombian tetras in a 300gallon tank. He is called the groke fish like the groke from the moomins. I have had him for a couple of years now. Information I have discovered include that they live in vast fairly fast flowing sections of the amazon and also that they have infested some artificial lakes. They breed through internal fertilisation with the female actually storing the sperm until spawning. Don't be too disheartened about your fish, you get rogues in any species, for example red tails, some people keep them with other fish quite happily and others are murderous vicious nasties. I grew mine (trachy)from about 3" so maybe that has something to do with it, he does have a bit of a barney now and again but never anything really nasty. Mind you that may change as he grows. Here is something else that might be usefull. Sick of looking at an "empty tank" well I keep colombian tetras in with all my catfish including juruense, trachy,lima and other predators and have yet to lose one. In a shoal those fish are uncatchable. If anyone reads this and is thinking of getting one (trachy) make sure you have a good cover for your tank, these fish can really jump. Oh and mine loves eating crickets and in fact water fleas (the tetras love criickets too, inducing a feeding frenzy to rival piranhas)

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 15 Sep 2006, 20:30

grokefish wrote: Sick of looking at an "empty tank" well I keep colombian tetras in with all my catfish including juruense, trachy,lima and other predators and have yet to lose one.

That's quite a daring experiment you've done with the tetras.
I for sure wouldn't have dared it with this (type of) fish, which is very gentle and harmless. I take it you're talking about the fish with the red fins and the blueish back and flanks? I keep forgetting whether this is Astyanax or Moenkhausia... I've always wanted my ditherfish to be able to stand up for themselves, because otherwise they might be eaten. And now you come up with this interesting story. It's good to hear that it works for some people and I might try it myself sometimes.
Anyway, I know what you mean with the "empty tank" part. It doesn't make me sick at all, but my wife makes remarks now and again that she prefered the Malawi tank I had a few years ago.
After many years of just catfishes and characins I was looking for something new and that turned out to be Malawi and (later) Tanganyika c*****ds and catfishes. While my family enjoyed the colourful and visible c****ds, I was very happy with a breeding colony of Synodontis multipunctatus and Lophiobagrus cyclurus (bred by coincidence), to name a few.
This experiment only lasted a couple of years. Then I returned to my first love: South American catfishes. No regrets

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 18 Sep 2006, 22:58

It's called the bruce lee experiment based on the art of fighting without fighting i.e running away, really, try catching colombian tetras even in an empty tank in a shoal of 10 or more. It took me three hours once to catch 22 of them, then my missus said, why dont I take most of the water out,obvious really, so I did and they still evaded me for ages because those fish can jump and really don't want to get caught.

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 19 Sep 2006, 15:12

Here I just read the descrition of trachycorystes trachycorystes and it said that they are black all over including belly. Well how definate is this? as mine has a white belly and always has had.

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 19 Sep 2006, 15:56

grokefish wrote:Here I just read the descrition of trachycorystes trachycorystes and it said that they are black all over including belly. Well how definate is this? as mine has a white belly and always has had.

When I initially wrote that description I mentioned the fact that there are exceptions to the black belly "rule". I also mentioned the fact that there are 4 known species(*) of Trachycorystes, so the white bellied specimen could also belong to another species. That part was left out because it could cause confusion.
So maybe you have an exceptional T. trachycorystes or -perhaps- a very similar looking but different species. I can't tell you that, because I never actually saw the other 3 species.

: another reason why that part was left out:
Fishbase has 4 valid species
CoF has 4 valid species
Cloffsca has 3 valid and 1 doubtful species
Acsi has 1 valid species

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 21 Sep 2006, 08:49

Maybe that is why mine is so mellow?

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 21 Sep 2006, 16:35

grokefish wrote:Maybe that is why mine is so mellow?

Maybe. Could you perhaps provide a picture of it?